[grim]

So where are the end points for your 'normal curve'? Gosh. What happens if I'm 2 percent outside the 'normal' curve. Guess I'm 'one of those', huh? Those. Them. Us. tribes. Nothing but tribes. And everyone is looking for theirs. And, if possible based in situations, look for a better tribe. A stronger one? One that agrees with you more than not? Those people? I can tell you that at the end of the day, we all retire to our crates. Some of us have nice crates. Some, pretty ratty. But we all have a crate, don't we? For the homeless, I would think there is a substantial number of thiose souls that don't like crates. They'd rather stay feral.

95% of a normal curve falls within two SD of the mean. We can safely throw away opinions on both sides beyond 2=SD simply because they are so few. In most discussions one side tries to convince the other side their opinion is correct. Zeolots dont listen so its a waste of time. These are opinions. Here are the most popular car colors

Most Popular Car Colors in America | Edmunds

These are the most popular and least popular car colors in America this year.

www.edmunds.com

Buy an orange car and you are probably beyond 2SD. Ive owned two and dont care that you or anyone else thinks it silly. If I could, Id get an orange GT3RS, they are beautiful, seen them at a dealer. Dont try to convince me its ugly cause Ill laugh and not care what you think.

similarly, In this case there are some people who actually believe the world will end, and have no children, etc, OTOH, on the other side, despite empirical data, some do not believe the world is getting warmer. These are opinions. If you try to argue with them, you are wasting your time.

So yeah, if you are in the 2% on either side your opinion is probably not relevant to the 95% anymore than my opinion of an orange car is relevant to 99.4% of Americans that looking at orange cars.

This has nothing to do with tribes but rather can you rationally discuss a subject with someone in the 5%. You cannot if their opinion is fixed. Nothing is going to change their mind anymore than you will change my mind on orange cars.

This has nothing to do with tribes. It has everything to do with fixed opinions where its pointless to argue with a stone wall.

 

[grim]

So of all I go to get take out and there is a college student who works who loves my black car but kept insisting that I see his fathers BMW i4 . Two of the other restaurant workers voiced that three loved the i4 when he showed them . Today he said "I have my dad's car . Do you want too see bit ? " He looked so eager and I started out by saying : you know I am not an EV fan , but I will, look . "

We get out to the car . On the exterior it looks like any other 4 door 4 series . I asked to see the inside . I get in the passenger seat . It feels very BMW . He gets in and I asked him to star it up. He says " the car is already on ." LOL . I forget for a moment that there is no sound . I asked him " dont you have not having sound. ?" His reply was " I love music and without sound I can appreciate it more . " I didnt ask to hearthe radio and he offered to drive it and show me .

He pulls out and the torque is instant . It does feel heavy enough for me to ask . He asked Siri and its as much as a Macan (in a sedan ) . Torque is instant 0-60 is 3.5 so this is in line with a Carrera S . However he pulled onto a highway and punched it on a roll and the car lets off at the top . It has a choice of regenerative braking and he showed me a demo of both modes . BMW made regenerative feel almost like downshifting . It was impressive compared to Tesla which was so abrupt . The road noise of the soundless engine and run flat tires is bad.

He answered all of my questions (nice kid ) . I asked if he worries about losing charge . He said it plugs it in each night even though he has plenty of range (300 miles ) . He said he doesnt worry about rain (waterproof charger ) . He also said that his father wants a Targa . the family uses a Volvo SUV for long trips , and that this car is more for getting around town as a daily .

The car can park itself but he said he never uses it. We got out of the car and I asked him doesnt he lock the car ? He said it automatically shuts off when he leaves his seat and locks when the key is further way .

It was an interesting generational dialogue .

In my afterthoughts I just feel like something is missing . I was impressed more than I thought I would be but cant see myself falling in love with it. I think back to the days when I ran home to get my checkbook because the car was that red hot that I wanted it TODAY !!! I do miss some of that .

It sounds like my new dryer.

• Its quiet for a dryer and has the normal cycles on the dial like heavy, permanent press, and delicate. But it can also download maybe 20 other cycles.
• I can view how many minutes left on my ipad and it will alert me when done.
• It will continue to spin clothes so they dont wrinkle and it warns me to clean the lint trap.
• Better yet I can remotely control it outside the house, and it will start and stop while Im not there.
• It reports the different cycles used and energy expended.
• Tell it your electric company and for some it will report how much doing a wash cost you

This is the world of appliances.

Do I give a about any of this? No, its an appliance. Throw the clothes in, hit the button, and get them out when done

 

[yrralis1]

It sounds like my new dryer.

• Its quiet for a dryer and has the normal cycles on the dial like heavy, permanent press, and delicate. But it can also download maybe 20 other cycles.
• I can view how many minutes left on my ipad and it will alert me when done.
• It will continue to spin clothes so they dont wrinkle and it warns me to clean the lint trap.
• Better yet I can remotely control it outside the house, and it will start and stop while Im not there.
• It reports the different cycles used and energy expended.
• Tell it your electric company and for some it will report how much doing a wash cost you

This is the world of appliances.

Do I give a about any of this? No, its an appliance. Throw the clothes in, hit the button, and get them out when done

Yep . It's not an M3 .
I understand the appeal for someone coming from a Camry which is ICE but silent , efficient , disconnected. . The BMW EV is actually an improvement because it tries to act like an Ice car . The regenerative brake feels like downshift . A person can stop and leave his foot off the brake . It's easy to fall asleep at a red light with a car like this . Stop and got traffic , talk radio , a red light , no sound , then zzzzzzzzzzzzzz.

 

[yrralis1]

They ran the i4 M50 against an M3 . Look at how close my guestimates were . I guessed 0- 60 super fast 3.5 (actual is 3.7) . I noticed it let off at the higher speeds . In contrasty my black modded 911 turbo hurls you into the next gear with full force and if snoozing wil blow right through the ev limiter .

He re the EV vs M3 at the only comparison there could ve .. straight line (on a track the EV would die quickly I imagine )

 

[///Bruce]

What do you think China calls those things we drive and drool over? “Transportation Appliances”.

 

[Jay Laifman]

I'm a long time Porsche nut. I have had my 1973 911 for over 35 years. My 1967 912 for 10 years. My 2000 Boxster S for 22 years. I had a 356 for many years - but still have all the others. My sons have an S2000 and Civic Type R. ALL the cars have been on the track. We also race karts and have a 1961 historic Elva race car. ICE is in our blood.

And yes, when Porsche first started making SUVs, I thought it was sacrilegious.

We just bought a new Macan 4 electric, and I have to say I love it. We have tried all the electric cars, and were actually looking for a plug in hybrid. But the Macan transcended all of them. Yes, it's not a light tossable sports car. And I will say, I do not like the Taycan. To me, unlike the Macan EV, the Tacan claims to be a sports car and I yet I feel like I'm driving a station wagon sled, and it can never be one of my other Porsches.

But the Macan is a totally different driving experience. So smooth. So powerful. Everything is well designed out. We did not buy it to save the world. I don't think it is a sports car really. Instead, we bought it because for what it is, we think it is a whole new driving experience that is better than an ICE in many ways (though certainly not all ways). Perhaps ICE Macans meet a need for others who don't have the other Porsches that we have. But since we already have those, this really is fantastic.

And I have to acknowledge the first Porsche cars were in fact electric (Lohner). So perhaps not so sacrilegious.

 

[yrralis1]

I'm a long time Porsche nut. I have had my 1973 911 for over 35 years. My 1967 912 for 10 years. My 2000 Boxster S for 22 years. I had a 356 for many years - but still have all the others. My sons have an S2000 and Civic Type R. ALL the cars have been on the track. We also race karts and have a 1961 historic Elva race car. ICE is in our blood.

And yes, when Porsche first started making SUVs, I thought it was sacrilegious.

We just bought a new Macan 4 electric, and I have to say I love it. We have tried all the electric cars, and were actually looking for a plug in hybrid. But the Macan transcended all of them. Yes, it's not a light tossable sports car. And I will say, I do not like the Taycan. To me, unlike the Macan EV, the Tacan claims to be a sports car and I yet I feel like I'm driving a station wagon sled, and it can never be one of my other Porsches.

But the Macan is a totally different driving experience. So smooth. So powerful. Everything is well designed out. We did not buy it to save the world. I don't think it is a sports car really. Instead, we bought it because for what it is, we think it is a whole new driving experience that is better than an ICE in many ways (though certainly not all ways). Perhaps ICE Macans meet a need for others who don't have the other Porsches that we have. But since we already have those, this really is fantastic.

And I have to acknowledge the first Porsche cars were in fact electric (Lohner). So perhaps not so sacrilegious.

if you had to pick one car for your house and you can only have one, would it be this one?

 

[Jay Laifman]

if you had to pick one car for your house and you can only have one, would it be this one?

Ha. I have thought about this very thing many times. I have been very fortunate to be able to keep all these cars, and buy them before they were worth so much! The most fortunate part may actually be being able to put them all somewhere safe! They have all been super reliable. And the hard part is that whichever I'm driving that day is the one I think is the best (and I have a Sunbeam Alpine and Tiger as well). Sometimes I think that the 911 is the hands down the best, blast to drive, rock solid, musical exhaust. But then a great drive in the Alpine - sentimental as my first car - with its totally different character, makes me think I couldn't part with that one!

My main point in posting was just to express how unexpectedly I really love the Macan EV. But not for the same reasons I love my other cars.

FWIW, the Macan replaces a 22 year old Acura MDX with 310,000 miles that is still running great.

 

[grim]

I have thought about this very thing many times. I have been very fortunate to be able to keep all these cars, and buy them before they were worth so much!

Pegasus I think few people are going to understand why thats there.

James Dean would be proud.

 

[Jay Laifman]

I think my main point is that I see EVs get a lot of negative comments. I actually agree with many of them. But at the same time, from a driving experience, this is no glorified golf cart. It is no utilitarian bland form of transportation from A to B. It truly takes an electric motor and uses its advantages to create a fantastic car ... for what it is. And it deserves praise.

Moreover, it is full of Porsche DNA.

And another thought on if this was our only car, when we bought it, a guy bought a GT3RS, and they were parked side by side. I spoke to the buyer and his young kids. Truth be told, the kids liked my 912 better (it's the red one in the picture above). Ha. But the other point is that that GT3RS was not his only car either. Porsche doesn't necessarily sell cars to be an only car. So if I'm going to own an SUV, why the heck not make it a Porsche, and in this case, with what an EV does offer.

 

[Jay Laifman]

Pegasus I think few people are going to understand why thats there.

James Dean would be proud.

And don't forget the 917 shift knob (which I built myself), with sport shifter, the GT3 racing buckets, Porsche sport exhaust, and lots of other goodies. Rest assured, when I'm in that car - it's my favorite! The most perfect sports car. Ha.

 

[grim]

And there is this ...

Volkswagen-Konzern - Datenleck: Wir wissen, wo dein Auto steht

VW hat mit einer neuen Blamage zu kämpfen. Bewegungsdaten von 800.000 E-Autos sowie Kontaktinformationen zu den Besitzern standen ungeschützt im Netz. Sichtbar war, wer wann zu Hause parkt, beim BND oder vor dem Bordell. Die SPIEGEL-Recherche.

www-spiegel-de.translate.goog

Dont worry, its translated

We know where your car is

Precise GPS tracking data for 800K EVs VW, Seat, Audis, and Skoda including contact info exposed.

Sure, buy a rolling smart phone on wheels

 

[reguy]

I think my main point is that I see EVs get a lot of negative comments. I actually agree with many of them. But at the same time, from a driving experience, this is no glorified golf cart. It is no utilitarian bland form of transportation from A to B. It truly takes an electric motor and uses its advantages to create a fantastic car ... for what it is. And it deserves praise.

Moreover, it is full of Porsche DNA.

And another thought on if this was our only car, when we bought it, a guy bought a GT3RS, and they were parked side by side. I spoke to the buyer and his young kids. Truth be told, the kids liked my 912 better (it's the red one in the picture above). Ha. But the other point is that that GT3RS was not his only car either. Porsche doesn't necessarily sell cars to be an only car. So if I'm going to own an SUV, why the heck not make it a Porsche, and in this case, with what an EV does offer.

View attachment 290886

Some of the negativity results from the understanding that the ice version of some models is being phased out and replaced by EV. Not everyone needs to love both ice and EV. If both forms exist going forward (there may be hope) the negativity should be reduced.

 

[Jkirkerx]

Very complex subject that can be debated for a long time. I'm not sure who's ideal it was for the US to have an all electric economy after building a oil and gas economy for over 120 years now. What took 120 years to build with oil and gas, they think an electric economy can be built in 15 years and I think they are dead wrong. Just like @grim said using refrigerants as an example, electric technology will change just as fast and be outdated every 5 years as they build into the future.

And yet the modern internal combustion engine is so clean now that it's ridiculous to compare the total amount of pollution and environmental damage compared to making EV cars, and the amount of natural resources and low skill human labor needed to harvest the minerals needed to construct EV cars. The proof is here now that the ICE engine can almost run on anything and is very reliable and durable, yet the other side of the argument refuses to hear the point.

The kids got brainwashed in school, thinking that a car runs on electricity, and once again trading nuclear or oil and gas produced energy into electricity is not the prime goal. I live in Orange County CA and you wouldn't believe how many Tesla cars are here driven by the younger generation, and they can't drive either, no clue. They can't even change a flat tire and call their parents to do it. Wish I can blame the parents of these kids for brainwashing as well, but I'm not sure where this info comes from.

I might buy an electric car soon, one of those Ford Mach E Rally or GT if they get better or if the price drops more. Just to drive around town like to Walmart or whatever. I don't like driving the Porsche to Walmart or the Grocery store, just feels weird. If I don't I'll look for an ICE car that is fun to drive and buy more gas.

One day, electricity will cost more than Gasoline.

 

[grim]

One day, electricity will cost more than Gasoline.

^^^^

Take this to the bank. They know exactly how much they can charge.

 

[Mii]

https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/5062541-tesla-cybertruck-las-vegas-trump/

In a later post, he said they had confirmed the explosion was caused by “very large fireworks and/or a bomb carried in the bed of the rented Cybertruck and is unrelated to the vehicle itself.”

Although this could be an isolated incident, but it does raise concern with potential explosion that can be much more destructive on EV!

 

[grim]

Although this could be an isolated incident, but it does raise concern with potential explosion that can be much more destructive on EV!

Not associated with being an EV, and, if fact, the cybertruck directed the blast upward

 

[grim]

 

[grim]

 

[Mii]

Porsche's EV sales took a hit last year, but the electric Macan sparks hope

Although sales of Porsche’s first EV, the Taycan, fell nearly 50% in 2024, things could be looking up for the...

electrek.co

Porsche delivered over 310,700 vehicles globally last year, or about 9,500 less than in 2023. Sales in China led the downfall, plunging 28% from the prior year amid a wave of low-cost domestic EVs entering the market.

Porsche sold 2,771 electric Macan SUVs in the US last year. On a call with reporters (via Automotive News), the company’s North American CEO, Timo Resch, said, “A lot of the consumers that come into the Macan Electric are [new to the] brand.”

I’m not here to say the electric Macan will be Porsche’s savior, but the strong sales start is promising. Porsche has already backtracked on plans for 80% of deliveries to be electric by 2030.

According to recent reports, the electric Cayenne, due out in 2026, could be delayed depending on market demand. The upcoming 718 Cayman and Boxster EVs could also face delays as Porsche plans to keep gas and hybrid models alive longer than expected.