I was interested in the new EV Macan but now feel disappointed after today's reveal. The only impressive announcement was the supposed, potential maximum range. The increased size, weight and high prices have put me off considering it as a replacement for my current GTS.
4ndy
Disappointed? Why? Were you not thrilled listening to the guy in German, with an English dub over, in an Asian city with all the enthusiasm the crowd seemed to have applauding everything the hostesses said?
@Footie got it right in that the launch indicated the target market, just like the 2013 launch at the LA Auto Show targeted the US market for SUVs. This car does not seem targeted for the EU or NA, but for China.
And for those interested in Singaporean Art Week and fancy sculptures.
Singapore Art Week 2024
@trusted is right. You are not walking out the door for less than $100K, including tax. Those Bespoke builds are killers. Thats puts it past a magic number that many people are hard pressed to get beyond.
Here is the announcement.
newsroom.porsche.com
The base car is a 4.9 car? I thought EVs were fast. $100K for a 4.9 car today seems weird.
World premiere: Porsche takes the all-electric 2024 Macan to a new level
The new Macan 4 and Macan Turbo aim to fulfill the requirements of Porsche customers choosing an SUV.
The base car is a 4.9 car? I thought EVs were fast. $100K for a 4.9 car today seems weird.
^^^ 😞🙁 Im sure the Canadians are going to love the Luxury Tax thats going to hit them.
You all are missing the most important option, the pm2.5 monitor. For $460, once the air pollution gets to some level, it automatically shuts of the extermal vents and routes all air through the cabin filter 
How is that! Once the Canadian wildfires restart, you are good. You will be the only one on your block driving around and 😃😀
How
is that! Once the Canadian wildfires restart, you are good. You will be the only one on your block driving around and 😃😀Most of the comments here are on specifics, I'm going to talk holistically, the overall approach and what I found disappointing.
The announcement.
The 95B.1 was announced at the Nov, 2013 LA Auto Show, live streamed under the bright lights on stage. Many people thought the Cayenne too big and eagerly awaited the Cajun, the baby Cayenne. The excitement was palpable. Watch, Maria Sharipova and a race car driver presented it.
OTOH, the EV Announcement was, IMO, blah. 30 minutes rambling on about sculptures, the live stream comments were brutal. And a taped video on “design” in German, dubbed in English. Why? It was dark, no visible excitement, just meh. Why not wait until Geneva next month?
Being announced in Singapore, my suspicion is the vehicle is not targeting to Europe, the Americas, or Oz, but to China, their largest customer base. I got up early to watch this announcement live and want that 45 minutes of time back.
Pricing
Pricing is what it is. The price is always going to go up. In May, based on published information, I guessed the new Turbo would come in the USA, stripped, at $108K The actual price is $107K. Stripped means no options, no dealer fees, etc. That $50K Macan S 10 years ago went OTD, excluding tax, for many people for $70K. That’s a shocking 40% in options. I don’t expect a EV Turbo to not go OTD for less than $125K. In two years it will be $140K. IMO, this is getting out of hand.
Launch strategy.
The normal sequence is base < S < GTS <Turbo< Turbo S. For the Macan, think Turbo PP as the Turbo S . The 95B.3 GTS, while the top current trim level will fall back into its normal slot. They just never built a 95b.3 Turbo, I suspect, because they wanted to kill the ICE car and the pandemic got in the way.
I DID rush out to put a deposit on a Turbo in 2013. I would never rush out to put out a deposit on an EV Turbo today because first, I know a Turbo S should be coming, and second, the technology advances too quickly. If Toyota gets solid state batteries out in a few years, these cars will be dinosaurs. Im not sure I understand the strategy of releasing the Base and Turbo trims and not the S and Turbo trims like the first generation car. But I assume they know exactly what they are doing because they are very very good at advertising, selling, and making huge profits. They know more than I do and the best at making profits.
End of an Era, or Epoch
While I don’t like the stock wheels in that they look like Tesla wheels, that’s minutia. The REAL option I do not like is the PM2.5 monitor. That enforces the concept this cars target audience is China.
I’ve driven through forest fires, you “rollup”, the windows, drive out of the area and all is good. In Spring, 2023, with Canadian wildfires, the news kept saying don’t go outdoors if you have lung issues. I get it. I liked the smell, reminiscent of the fireplace on but the sky was smoky like fog. I don’t know what the great London SMOG was like nor LA in the early 70s. But I get it. Its not pleasant and who likes air pollution? And I get it that EVs are about reducing emissions, so its not surprising they provide an option for an air monitor. I looked at this chart https://waqi.info/ Its easy to see the Americas and Oz are mostly green. Europe a bit worse, but India/China are terrible. Hence, I believe again this car is targeted to their primary customer, China.
All things come to an end. Porsche is rooted in racing, from James Dean in his cursed 550 Spyder to, more importantly, taking over from Ford at Le Mans and just dominating road racing with 917s being too fast at Mulsanne. With legendary names like 935, 956, 962, and the lastest 919. I see that’s all over now. New car buyers, Gen Z maybe, have no idea what its like to drive a MT or even get a license.
I think most enthusiasts had some poster on the wall a kid, maybe a Countach, Ferrari, or 911. Its one thing to build a new model with a different drivetrain, the Taycan. That’s fine. Its another to start taking existing models and changing them. I don’t see that advantageous, other than to meet mandates to stay in business.
James A Michener said it best “only the rocks live forever” So it matters not how long you live, but “how” and for a good long run, they certainly lived well. Bravo, well done.
The future is for the young, I guess. Things will evolve and sort themselves out. All things change … except the rocks.
The announcement.
The 95B.1 was announced at the Nov, 2013 LA Auto Show, live streamed under the bright lights on stage. Many people thought the Cayenne too big and eagerly awaited the Cajun, the baby Cayenne. The excitement was palpable. Watch, Maria Sharipova and a race car driver presented it.
OTOH, the EV Announcement was, IMO, blah. 30 minutes rambling on about sculptures, the live stream comments were brutal. And a taped video on “design” in German, dubbed in English. Why? It was dark, no visible excitement, just meh. Why not wait until Geneva next month?
Being announced in Singapore, my suspicion is the vehicle is not targeting to Europe, the Americas, or Oz, but to China, their largest customer base. I got up early to watch this announcement live and want that 45 minutes of time back.
Pricing
Pricing is what it is. The price is always going to go up. In May, based on published information, I guessed the new Turbo would come in the USA, stripped, at $108K The actual price is $107K. Stripped means no options, no dealer fees, etc. That $50K Macan S 10 years ago went OTD, excluding tax, for many people for $70K. That’s a shocking 40% in options. I don’t expect a EV Turbo to not go OTD for less than $125K. In two years it will be $140K. IMO, this is getting out of hand.
Launch strategy.
The normal sequence is base < S < GTS <Turbo< Turbo S. For the Macan, think Turbo PP as the Turbo S . The 95B.3 GTS, while the top current trim level will fall back into its normal slot. They just never built a 95b.3 Turbo, I suspect, because they wanted to kill the ICE car and the pandemic got in the way.
I DID rush out to put a deposit on a Turbo in 2013. I would never rush out to put out a deposit on an EV Turbo today because first, I know a Turbo S should be coming, and second, the technology advances too quickly. If Toyota gets solid state batteries out in a few years, these cars will be dinosaurs. Im not sure I understand the strategy of releasing the Base and Turbo trims and not the S and Turbo trims like the first generation car. But I assume they know exactly what they are doing because they are very very good at advertising, selling, and making huge profits. They know more than I do and the best at making profits.
End of an Era, or Epoch
While I don’t like the stock wheels in that they look like Tesla wheels, that’s minutia. The REAL option I do not like is the PM2.5 monitor. That enforces the concept this cars target audience is China.
I’ve driven through forest fires, you “rollup”, the windows, drive out of the area and all is good. In Spring, 2023, with Canadian wildfires, the news kept saying don’t go outdoors if you have lung issues. I get it. I liked the smell, reminiscent of the fireplace on but the sky was smoky like fog. I don’t know what the great London SMOG was like nor LA in the early 70s. But I get it. Its not pleasant and who likes air pollution? And I get it that EVs are about reducing emissions, so its not surprising they provide an option for an air monitor. I looked at this chart https://waqi.info/ Its easy to see the Americas and Oz are mostly green. Europe a bit worse, but India/China are terrible. Hence, I believe again this car is targeted to their primary customer, China.
All things come to an end. Porsche is rooted in racing, from James Dean in his cursed 550 Spyder to, more importantly, taking over from Ford at Le Mans and just dominating road racing with 917s being too fast at Mulsanne. With legendary names like 935, 956, 962, and the lastest 919. I see that’s all over now. New car buyers, Gen Z maybe, have no idea what its like to drive a MT or even get a license.
I think most enthusiasts had some poster on the wall a kid, maybe a Countach, Ferrari, or 911. Its one thing to build a new model with a different drivetrain, the Taycan. That’s fine. Its another to start taking existing models and changing them. I don’t see that advantageous, other than to meet mandates to stay in business.
James A Michener said it best “only the rocks live forever” So it matters not how long you live, but “how” and for a good long run, they certainly lived well. Bravo, well done.
The future is for the young, I guess. Things will evolve and sort themselves out. All things change … except the rocks.
"Only the rocks live forever."
Michener
Porsche had a good and long run. Sooner or later another contender was going to take its place. Corvette has long been a contender for the sports cars and cheaper. They were also smart enough to go mid-engined. I'm not sure there is a SUV contender.
It is depressing, like when one spouse of an elderly, long married couple dies and then the other spouse no longer has the will to live. 😥 And worse, it's forced on them by external forces, not voluntary. For some of us, its like our entire adult lives so the analogy stands. 😰
And there it is, if true.
Porsche Macan EV range to expand with GT, GTS and more - carsales.com.au
Entry single-motor RWD model also set for Porsche’s new electric Macan SUV, while 500kW-plus GT a hot tip at the top endwww.carsales.com.au
But I doubt it will be a Weissach GT since AP said Macans dont race, but a Turbo S SURE.
Early adopters to Turbos will be 😡😭
Sure there was, MY18, 0.5% of US sales as the PP.
For the performance oriented, and the core membership here gravitates to the most powerful model over the years, that will become the EV halo car. Why wasnt it called the Turbo S? My guess is the long known fact they had to electrify.
Macan USA sales #s by trim level
These are PCNA numbers only. I cannot grantee 100% accuracy, but should be very close at a minimum. I came across these when I "researched" ordered 718 Spyder options for a spreadsheet I created for my curiousity. Macan sales by trim level broken down by model year: MY 2015 MY 2016 MY 2017 MY...
www.macanforum.com
A couple of things you guys are discussing.
First, the Macan Turbo PP "technically" is not a trim level. Rather the PP was an "option". Why? I got no idea. I think most people thought the S would come out but instead they went to the short lived .2 version of the car. My suspicious is they expect the second generation car, the EV, to come out in MY20, but the pandemic happened. They have known for a very long time that the emissions fines would destroy the company. But I think a lot of that got pushed back because of the pandemic. Since the Macan EV is the second generation vehicle, I fully expect a Turbo S model and apparently the #2 guy at PAG confirmed it.
Second, AFAIK, the Cayenne GT is NOT a Motorsports car, so don't even talk about it in the same breath as a GT2, GT3, or GT4. You see those numerics after GT? Those are the racing classes. GT2 no longer races but the 3 and 4 DO race.
Andreas Preuninger (AP) runs the GT racing division, ie, motorsports. Those cars are meant to be homologation cars for the Race cars. You can look them up what each one does but generally speaking, the GT3 allows Porsche to run in the WEC GT3 class. Here is an example
newsroom.porsche.com
This is the latest 911 GT3 R (R as in Racing). Its homogolation car is the 992 GT3.
"homologated for the FIA GTE category; homologation basis: Porsche 911 GT3 (992 series)."
AP has EXPLICITLY stated there will NOT be a GT Macan or Cayenne. Quote:
“The credibility of the GT car is based on direct bloodline to the race cars,” he told C/D. “A customer buying a GT3 knows there’s a derivative that’s on track every other weekend in a different race series. ... “If we were to enter the Dakar rally with a Macan or Cayenne—something we have no plans to do—then maybe the Motorsport department would develop that car and bring it to the race. Then I would see a good excuse to make something for the street that is very close,” Preuninger said. “But to just use a badge on a Panamera or Cayenne to make it more attractive, for me, would not be credible. It would only be marketing, I don’t think that’s the right thing to do."
But wait, there is Cayenne Turbo GT, right? But its NOT a motorsports division car that I can tell. It's just another trim level.
www.topgear.com
This Cayenne isn’t a pedigree product of the same Weissach skunkworks that brings you the 911 GT2 and GT3. It’s said to ‘have the blessing’ of the GT department.
What does that mean? It would seem some design came out of Weissach but its not a motorsports vehicle. There is no racing class for SUVs that I know. Here is a 2023 article on the new Cayenne
newsroom.porsche.com
In addition to realigning the drive portfolio, the engineers at the Porsche Development Centre in Weissach made major revisions to the Cayenne’s chassis system.
So when they mention Weissach, that doesn't seem to necessarily mean Motorsports.
newsroom.porsche.com
Every Porsche has the same origin: the Development Centre in Weissach.
If someone has some evidence the Cayenne Turbo GT is a motorsports car, please provide it. Similarly I expect the Macan EV GT to be the same thing, "blessed" but not a motorsports car under AP. There is a HUGE difference between being a vehicle designed as a homologation car and a street production car. Porsche trim levels can confuse anyone. Macan Turbo? They are all Turbos, etc.
First, the Macan Turbo PP "technically" is not a trim level. Rather the PP was an "option". Why? I got no idea. I think most people thought the S would come out but instead they went to the short lived .2 version of the car. My suspicious is they expect the second generation car, the EV, to come out in MY20, but the pandemic happened. They have known for a very long time that the emissions fines would destroy the company. But I think a lot of that got pushed back because of the pandemic. Since the Macan EV is the second generation vehicle, I fully expect a Turbo S model and apparently the #2 guy at PAG confirmed it.
Second, AFAIK, the Cayenne GT is NOT a Motorsports car, so don't even talk about it in the same breath as a GT2, GT3, or GT4. You see those numerics after GT? Those are the racing classes. GT2 no longer races but the 3 and 4 DO race.
Andreas Preuninger (AP) runs the GT racing division, ie, motorsports. Those cars are meant to be homologation cars for the Race cars. You can look them up what each one does but generally speaking, the GT3 allows Porsche to run in the WEC GT3 class. Here is an example
Debut for the newest generation of the Porsche 911 GT3 R
The new Porsche 911 GT3 R will be unveiled to the public at this year’s 24 Hours of Spa-Francorchamps. Compared to its predecessor, the new 911 GT3 R features a larger engine producing up to 565 HP, a more constant aerodynamic performance and an optimized vehicle balance.
This is the latest 911 GT3 R (R as in Racing). Its homogolation car is the 992 GT3.
"homologated for the FIA GTE category; homologation basis: Porsche 911 GT3 (992 series)."
AP has EXPLICITLY stated there will NOT be a GT Macan or Cayenne. Quote:
“The credibility of the GT car is based on direct bloodline to the race cars,” he told C/D. “A customer buying a GT3 knows there’s a derivative that’s on track every other weekend in a different race series. ... “If we were to enter the Dakar rally with a Macan or Cayenne—something we have no plans to do—then maybe the Motorsport department would develop that car and bring it to the race. Then I would see a good excuse to make something for the street that is very close,” Preuninger said. “But to just use a badge on a Panamera or Cayenne to make it more attractive, for me, would not be credible. It would only be marketing, I don’t think that’s the right thing to do."
But wait, there is Cayenne Turbo GT, right? But its NOT a motorsports division car that I can tell. It's just another trim level.
Porsche Cayenne Turbo GT Coupe review: a 631bhp super-SUV with carbon aero Reviews 2023 | Top Gear
A two-tonne 4x4 that needs actual downforce? Purr-lease. Apparently, those funny carbon Shrek ears either side of the roof spoiler – and the 25mm-longer ducktail on the pop-up rear wing – aren’t just visual shorthand for ‘I’ve bought the most expensive non-hybrid Porsche Cayenne’. Apparently...
This Cayenne isn’t a pedigree product of the same Weissach skunkworks that brings you the 911 GT2 and GT3. It’s said to ‘have the blessing’ of the GT department.
What does that mean? It would seem some design came out of Weissach but its not a motorsports vehicle. There is no racing class for SUVs that I know. Here is a 2023 article on the new Cayenne
Testing of the new Porsche Cayenne reaches the home straight
Porsche is meticulously preparing the new Cayenne for its launch. Until then, the prototypes and pre-production vehicles are being subjected to challenging endurance tests to ensure that they meet Porsche’s high quality standards.
In addition to realigning the drive portfolio, the engineers at the Porsche Development Centre in Weissach made major revisions to the Cayenne’s chassis system.
So when they mention Weissach, that doesn't seem to necessarily mean Motorsports.
Development Centre Weissach: the heart of Porsche
Every Porsche has the same origin: the Development Centre in Weissach. Take a glimpse into the secret grounds, which extend to around a hundred hectares.
Every Porsche has the same origin: the Development Centre in Weissach.
If someone has some evidence the Cayenne Turbo GT is a motorsports car, please provide it. Similarly I expect the Macan EV GT to be the same thing, "blessed" but not a motorsports car under AP. There is a HUGE difference between being a vehicle designed as a homologation car and a street production car. Porsche trim levels can confuse anyone. Macan Turbo? They are all Turbos, etc.
Anyone wanting a European focused remarks on the EV might want to read rennteam's take on it. Be aware its mostly high end vehicles, exotics and the like, and 911 centric.
The editors POV is the same I mentioned. Sooner or later there will be a breakthrough in chemistry and the early adopters will be crying, more or less.
This is inevitable. There is no Moore's Law for chemistry or physics, but innovation will occur as EVs move out of the realm of the early adopters into the mainstream, or possible the egg before the chicken, etc. Perhaps Toyota always knew, it is premature.
The editors POV is the same I mentioned. Sooner or later there will be a breakthrough in chemistry and the early adopters will be crying, more or less.
This is inevitable. There is no Moore's Law for chemistry or physics, but innovation will occur as EVs move out of the realm of the early adopters into the mainstream, or possible the egg before the chicken, etc. Perhaps Toyota always knew, it is premature.
This thread was going way OT, sometimes that happens without intentional hijacking. All posts not specific to the OP, that is, Disappointment with the new Macan EV, have been moved to the "Macan EV, EVs, Porsche Future with EVs, rants and random thoughts" thread.
A suggestion for those intent on buying the EV. Don't try to rationalize it or defend your choice. Its your money, do with it as you please. You will not convince anyone to change their mind when no one even owns one yet. Similarly, there is no point in those who oppose buying one to argue against it. Those who are intent on buying one, will do whatever they want with their money, with or without your input.
I suggest, urge, anyone who buys one to post up your delivery in the appropriate section, your specs, etc and once driven, express your opinion on the good, and the bad, in a user review so we can ALL read and see what a member thinks. That is EXACTLY why the user review forum exist, to express your feeling about your car. We have many, many such reviews for the ICE car. Its just a matter of time before the EV reviews start coming in, maybe six month?
In the meantime, if you want to rant in either direction about EVs in general, lets confine that to the Rants thread.
Thanks and carry on here
A suggestion for those intent on buying the EV. Don't try to rationalize it or defend your choice. Its your money, do with it as you please. You will not convince anyone to change their mind when no one even owns one yet. Similarly, there is no point in those who oppose buying one to argue against it. Those who are intent on buying one, will do whatever they want with their money, with or without your input.
I suggest, urge, anyone who buys one to post up your delivery in the appropriate section, your specs, etc and once driven, express your opinion on the good, and the bad, in a user review so we can ALL read and see what a member thinks. That is EXACTLY why the user review forum exist, to express your feeling about your car. We have many, many such reviews for the ICE car. Its just a matter of time before the EV reviews start coming in, maybe six month?
In the meantime, if you want to rant in either direction about EVs in general, lets confine that to the Rants thread.
Thanks and carry on here
Once again this thread drifted OT. And once again I had to clean this up.
This thread is about "disappointment in the Macan EV", its not about anything else. Please follow our rules and don't go OT again. General discussion on EV or anything else is at https://www.macanforum.com/threads/...m/threads/macan-ev-evs-porsche-future-with-evs-rants-and-random-thoughts.190893
thanks
This thread is about "disappointment in the Macan EV", its not about anything else. Please follow our rules and don't go OT again. General discussion on EV or anything else is at https://www.macanforum.com/threads/...m/threads/macan-ev-evs-porsche-future-with-evs-rants-and-random-thoughts.190893
thanks
No, the 986, in 1996, and Toyota teaching them JIT inventory saved them. The Cayenne came in 2003, and made them more profitable. The Macan saved nothing. They were highly profitable. The Macan R&D set them back from about $18K per car to $14K profit, but more units.
No, PAG is not going out of business, Porsche SE owns the majority of VAG shares and the “family” owns 100% of the voting shares. They have little to worry about. Since EU laws effect ALL the carmakers, the entire industry will survive or go under. Either get with the program or get left behind. The world will move on without the US. The US is no longer the biggest customer, China had been for years. If they lose the US, they will survive. Its not 1985 anymore.
The 911 wont matter, the 992.2 is a hybrid. The rich might use efuels. But the glory days are gone. They are now building a full sized ev above the Cayenne. ICE 718 are gone. They will survive with or without the US simply because the ROW will move on without the US leaving us as ancient history, luddites in a rapidly evolving world.
thats the practical pov. not trying to defend evs. It is what it is.Stockholders already told him that
Porsche stockholders are not happy
6/7/24
Porsche’s EV Targets Face Investor Pushback Over Slowdown
Porsche AG shareholders are calling on the luxury-car maker to ease off its electric-vehicle push as a global slowdown for the technology threatens sales and profits.
At the company’s annual shareholder meeting on Friday, Chief Executive Officer Oliver Blume was asked why he’s sticking with a goal for plug-in Porsches to account for more than half of sales next year. Rivals including Mercedes-Benz Group AG are walking backtheir EV ambitions due to poor demand.
They responded
Porsche posts strong second quarter with a 17 percent return on sales – and a robust first six months of 2024
Porsche AG achieved stronger results in the second quarter of 2024 than in the previous quarter and is reporting robust financial figures for the first half-year.
As the transformation to electromobility is developing very differently around the world, we have already started to recalibrate and reprioritize projects and products with regard to ICE technology.” Part of the strategy is retaining the greatest possible flexibility in the production of the different types of powertrains. Porsche continues to focus on three powertrain types: all-electric vehicles, efficient plug-in hybrids and exhilarating ICE engines.
Here are actual "first user reports" being tracked. Most problems look like sw problems to me
Issues Reported List for Macan EV Electric
If it would be helpful, I would like to collect in this discussion records of problems described by users up to the date given in the title: Area / thread link Issue Region User Cause Fix Air Conditioning no cooling is provided. US @n4v4nod No freon installed Freon filled (200->1200g +...
www.macanevowners.com
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