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BTW, as far as I'm aware, the terms big end and mains are interchangeable regarding engine bearings...
Nope. Mains hold the crank in place, 'big-ends' are, as you stated, bearings at the rod/crankshaft interface.
 
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I'm late to the party, but excellent and spot on summary @alex_c

I'm now owning a MY17 Turbo and did own a GTS for a while before my Turbo so I think I should chime in a bit of unbiased feedback in favour of the GTS that I don't own anymore. The chassis, pse improvements and driving dynamic improvements that are specific to GTS really makes it very special and something that any aftermarket solution can just dream about fixing. I'm missing out on all these features on my Turbo. That is a firm fact! Now I wish for a Turbo S with all the GTS driving dynamic goodies!

Also, comments about fake exhaust and speakers for PSE... Please, just stop this incorrect information and get the facts right before posting. Macan Diesel PSE is one exception with a very different PSE solution but please don't mix that up with the petrol versions. And for those having doubts about differences between GTS PSE and Turbo PSE. The GTS PSE does sound sportier and a tad bit raspier/louder.

But independent of how good tweaks there are, this SUV will never be part of the legendary line-up :D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kwal30Qu35Q&feature=youtu.be
 

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I'm late to the party, but excellent and spot on summary @alex_c

I'm now owning a MY17 Turbo and did own a GTS for a while before my Turbo so I think I should chime in a bit of unbiased feedback in favour of the GTS that I don't own anymore. The chassis, pse improvements and driving dynamic improvements that are specific to GTS really makes it very special and something that any aftermarket solution can just dream about fixing. I'm missing out on all these features on my Turbo. That is a firm fact! Now I wish for a Turbo S with all the GTS driving dynamic goodies!

Also, comments about fake exhaust and speakers for PSE... Please, just stop this incorrect information and get the facts right before posting. Macan Diesel PSE is one exception with a very different PSE solution but please don't mix that up with the petrol versions. And for those having doubts about differences between GTS PSE and Turbo PSE. The GTS PSE does sound sportier and a tad bit raspier/louder.

But independent of how good tweaks there are, this SUV will never be part of the legendary line-up :D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kwal30Qu35Q&feature=youtu.be
May I ask why you went for the turbo after owning the GTS?
 

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May I ask why you went for the turbo after owning the GTS?
A few reasons listed below in bullet form... But in general I didn't like the spec I went for and when my dealer by coinsidence got a great specced out MY17 Turbo in his inventory I made a quick swap... The reasons are of course IMO and I fully understand that many has the opposit opinion. Each to their own as always.

-When I took delivery it turned out that I didn't like the color in combination with my spec. It got too black for me with all the blacked out details in combination with the Volcano Grey paint. I wanted something more elegant than mean with a bit more contrast.
-Had the roof rails on the GTS and didn't like them. Have no practical use for them either.
-Think the Turbo front-end looks better than GTS/SD-package. Especially the indicators on the GTS/SD looks dated and like it belongs on an Audi A6 from 2006.
-Felt that the extra power of the Turbo would make no harm
-Fun to change car and got a very good deal that I couldn't resist

On the minus side I gave up the driving dynamic enhancements on the GTS and the louder PSE, but since I use the car as Daily Driver the extra torque and quiter exhaust has turned out to be more useful than I thought.
 

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Question:
I have an S with the 20'' wheels,are they the same wheel fitted to the GTS,as I would like to see a larger GTS like tire fitted to mine?

Thank you in advance!

Mike
 

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Discussion Starter · #46 ·
Question:

I have an S with the 20'' wheels,are they the same wheel fitted to the GTS,as I would like to see a larger GTS like tire fitted to mine?



Thank you in advance!



Mike


Yes, the GTS RS Spyders are also 20".


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First of all, I'm not "regurgitating PR info". I'm trying to find facts to illustrate the difference between GTS and other models, plain and simple. And I thought it was necessary based on the uninformed comments all around regarding the GTS, like "the only difference is that it is 10mm lower, so you can do the same with $150 lowering links and save $12K!".

The logos info was only to indicate where the GTS moniker appears on this model. I don't recall seeing the "S" on the corresponding tach of the S. So that is the kind of uninformed comments I am trying to avoid.

And no, I am NOT feeling "insure" (sic). Perhaps you meant "insecure", which I am not feeling either. Actually I am extremely happy to have chosen a GTS, and that is why I wanted to research as much info as available on what makes this vehicle different.

And no, the marketing department was not convincing at all, as I did not get any marketing info at all before ordering the GTS. I simply read the specs and did pricing analysis comparing all 3 models and came out with the conclusion that for me the best option was the GTS.

Perhaps it is you who is feeling "insure" after reading that what you thought was only cosmetic changes on the GTS are not just so. ;)

And by the way, the Macan DOES NOT have a speaker induced exhaust sound. It is naturally generated. The changes to the air intake and lower exhaust pressure help with the PSE sound naturally, which sounds quite different from an S or a Turbo. And by "different" I mean better.

If you are going to dispute a post, please document yourself first.

Sorry to disappoint on the fake exhaust noise but item 15 here is the electronic sound composer and amplifier and item 16 is the speaker or transducer mounted at the base of the windscreen that causes the bulkhead and windscreen to resonate.


http://www.macanownersclub.co.uk/forum/uploads/923/mc2474EN.pdf kindly posted in the UK forum and previous on this one.




This was discussed in another thread. You can find these parts if you pull the plastic cover at the top of the firewall. It is clipped in place but rather fiddly to replace.


This document was released before the GTS to guide adding PSE to the S and Turbo models. The GTS has this already fitted. You can google the part numbers and see how they work in various Audi's and VW's.


Also of note is that the PSE exhaust tips are severely cut back at the top rear and slots are opened up to reflect more sound into the car.


So in addition to the valves there are two other means to "tune" the perceived exhaust note in petrol engined cars just within the cabin. Externally there is just one method, the valves and mufflers.


Diesel cars use these tricks and in addition have another trick with an additional speaker added to the mufflers. That is not what I am referring to here. Nor is this the infamous sound symposer (tuned induction noise leak into the cabin) used in some Porsche sports cars.


Perhaps you can cite your source of "The changes to the air intake and lower exhaust pressure help with the PSE sound naturally, which sounds quite different from an S or a Turbo"? Sounds like feel-good content-free marketing spin to me? Remember these are all turbo cars with all the plumbing that kills the chance of rich natural noise.
 

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Sorry to disappoint on the fake exhaust noise but item 15 here is the electronic sound composer and amplifier and item 16 is the speaker or transducer mounted at the base of the windscreen that causes the bulkhead and windscreen to resonate.


http://www.macanownersclub.co.uk/forum/uploads/923/mc2474EN.pdf kindly posted in the UK forum and previous on this one.




This was discussed in another thread. You can find these parts if you pull the plastic cover at the top of the firewall. It is clipped in place but rather fiddly to replace.


This document was released before the GTS to guide adding PSE to the S and Turbo models. The GTS has this already fitted. You can google the part numbers and see how they work in various Audi's and VW's.


Also of note is that the PSE exhaust tips are severely cut back at the top rear and slots are opened up to reflect more sound into the car.


So in addition to the valves there are two other means to "tune" the perceived exhaust note in petrol engined cars just within the cabin. Externally there is just one method, the valves and mufflers.


Diesel cars use these tricks and in addition have another trick with an additional speaker added to the mufflers. That is not what I am referring to here. Nor is this the infamous sound symposer (tuned induction noise leak into the cabin) used in some Porsche sports cars.


Perhaps you can cite your source of "The changes to the air intake and lower exhaust pressure help with the PSE sound naturally, which sounds quite different from an S or a Turbo"? Sounds like feel-good content-free marketing spin to me? Remember these are all turbo cars with all the plumbing that kills the chance of rich natural noise.
Pretty much every professional review talks about the revised intake path and new exhaust.. since you used a UK source I'll do the same;

Porsche Macan GTS Review (2016) | Autocar
"With its more efficient air induction, reduced exhaust back pressure and boost pressure increase..."

I’m not sure what a “Noise Pulse Sender” is used for, but it certainly couldn’t have any impact on the exhaust sound considering it’s in the engine compartment mounted below the windshield…. Maybe it gives an audible feedback into the cabin of RPMs when in PSE or Sport+ modes? No idea… But you want to be sure it’s not influencing what you hear in the exhaust, go stand behind *ANY* Macan with PSE… the sound is completely different… Heck, if the actuator made that much of a difference why swap out the entire exhaust?

As I mentioned earlier in this thread, Porsche is very proud of the exhaust note on every one of their cars. They have a section on the top floor of the Porsche Museum in Stuttgart showing all the work that goes into making that trademark Porsche sound… And it’s about 20 ft away from the Macan GTS on display.
 

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I'd also be interested in what the noise pulse sender does. It seems to be too small and lightly supported for the clear bass needed to augment the existing sound, and the location seems odd for distribution of exhaust generated sound. But it must do something fairly significant.
 

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Pretty much every professional review talks about the revised intake path and new exhaust
I've learned to take professional reviews with a grain of salt.

Sure, if the reviewer has actually spent some real time with the car (and hopefully driven the car, too) it's usually interesting and valuable to read their opinions, but very often so called "professional reviews" are merely regurgitations of the marketing spin a manufacturer provides the automotive press.

In this case were the "professional reviewers" actually able to see and understand the specifics of the revised intake path and new exhaust, and what's actually better about it? I would really doubt it.

How many times have you seen a manufacturer's marketing people claim "oh yes, we have the latest and greatest exhaust system" when the truth is that the marketing people were trying to grasp on to something to say about the their latest model, and the "professional reviewers" would trying to grasp on to something significant to write about, and the changes to the car had nothing to do with better performance but were made merely to save money :)

Not saying that's what happened here (I would not know), but I often find myself reading things like this with a lot of skepicism.
 

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@gir asked someone to cite a source which backs up the revised air intake and reduced back pressure and I provided a reliable, professional car review site.




I've learned to take professional reviews with a grain of salt.

Sure, if the reviewer has actually spent some real time with the car (and hopefully driven the car, too) it's usually interesting and valuable to read their opinions, but very often so called "professional reviews" are merely regurgitations of the marketing spin a manufacturer provides the automotive press.

In this case were the "professional reviewers" actually able to see and understand the specifics of the revised intake path and new exhaust, and what's actually better about it? I would really doubt it.

How many times have you seen a manufacturer's marketing people claim "oh yes, we have the latest and greatest exhaust system" when the truth is that the marketing people were trying to grasp on to something to say about the their latest model, and the "professional reviewers" would trying to grasp on to something significant to write about, and the changes to the car had nothing to do with better performance but were made merely to save money :)

Not saying that's what happened here (I would not know), but I often find myself reading things like this with a lot of skepicism.
 

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I'd also be interested in what the noise pulse sender does. It seems to be too small and lightly supported for the clear bass needed to augment the existing sound, and the location seems odd for distribution of exhaust generated sound. But it must do something fairly significant.

The transducer may be small, but the effective diaphragm (equivalent of a loudspeaker cone) which is the windscreen and part of the bulkhead is probably 2 square meters! Porsche refers to a "tuning fork" concept in Macan engineering literature. Tuning forks are virtually silent until you put them against a resonant surface.


Sound shakers (similar devices) that are used to make sub bass noises such as explosions and earthquakes are also small. They rattle the structure they are bolted to.
 

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@gir asked someone to cite a source which backs up the revised air intake and reduced back pressure and I provided a reliable, professional car review site.

Yes but as @Shark points out, many of those so called professional reviewers are lazy and often lift text and concepts from press releases. Press releases and back up information for a new product introductions are often littered with feel-good trite and plausibly deniable BS. Sure the extra HP came from somewhere. The PR that even Autocar lazily lifted text from listed 3 items - Boost, Free flowing exhaust and Induction. They didn't say all 3 make the PSE sound better. In any case this was not the full review just a quick note on a new variation and even Autocar gets lazy doing those.


What triggered my first response in this thread was the Porsche Pikes Peak PR that was clearly sprinkled with ambiguous hyperbole. Of course the product manger of the GTS is going to say its the best car yet! It's his job and if he doesn't he's fired!


Nothing wrong with good "sound engineering" but lets not take the PR bate hook, line and sinker, or be in denial on how cars are acoustically engineered today. Porsche uses just about all known sound engineering tricks in various recent vehicles. They just tend to down play most of them other than Exhaust Valves and Mufflers.


Porsche probably spent close to $1M in wining and dining journalists and staging the Pikes Peak event. They expect good coverage for that regardless of the car (which I'm sure is very good.)
 

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I apologize in advance if I am jumping in at the wrong place as I am learning and new to the forum. I would appreciate input. Wish I had been wise enough to pay more attention to the forum prior to beginning my order process. I have ordered a well appointed Macan S (premium pkg plus, spyder wheels, nav, 18 way seats, etc) with a November build date. Delivery expected January. After reading the GTS comments on this thread I am scratching my head thinking I may should have ordered a GTS. My dealer has a large GTS inventory in stock. I may be obligated to my special order, but I am sure they could move the S rather quickly should I choose to buy a GTS off the dealers lot. I am looking online at several GTS cars that are not as well appointed with "options" as my S, however it appears many of my options ordered on the S come standard on the GTS. I am looking at a price difference of maybe $5,000. Don't have to have the 18 way seats or nav. Should I step up to the GTS and pay the price difference? This thread tells me the answer is YES. Input greatly appreciated.
 

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I apologize in advance if I am jumping in at the wrong place as I am learning and new to the forum. I would appreciate input. Wish I had been wise enough to pay more attention to the forum prior to beginning my order process. I have ordered a well appointed Macan S (premium pkg plus, spyder wheels, nav, 18 way seats, etc) with a November build date. Delivery expected January. After reading the GTS comments on this thread I am scratching my head thinking I may should have ordered a GTS. My dealer has a large GTS inventory in stock. I may be obligated to my special order, but I am sure they could move the S rather quickly should I choose to buy a GTS off the dealers lot. I am looking online at several GTS cars that are not as well appointed with "options" as my S, however it appears many of my options ordered on the S come standard on the GTS. I am looking at a price difference of maybe $5,000. Don't have to have the 18 way seats or nav. Should I step up to the GTS and pay the price difference? This thread tells me the answer is YES. Input greatly appreciated.
I would say YES and I am sure most of Macan experts here would also say same even without looking at your Macan S build.

Please share your build.
 

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Macan S or GTS?

I would say YES and I am sure most of Macan experts here would also say same even without looking at your Macan S build.

Please share your build.
Many of these things I can live without. Reading conflicting info that Sport Plus is standard on GTS? Appreciate your comments.
Macan s
White
Std Interior in Blk
Hitch
Navigation Module
White Instrument Dial
Lane Change Assist
20" Spyder Wheels
Window Trim in High Gloss Black
Premium Pkg Plus
PDLS
Auto Dimming Mirrors
18 way adaptive seats
 

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The quick of it is Yes but, it all depends if the standard options on the GTS is what you want and can afford.


Sent from AutoGuide.com Free App
 

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GTS vs S

The quick of it is Yes but, it all depends if the standard options on the GTS is what you want and can afford.


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I like the idea of "all the options you want and none that you don't need". I typically keep cars 2-3 years and have found that if you trade often try not to load a car up as its hard to recoup. I think I can live with a GTS with fewer options than the S as the GTS comes with some great goodies as is. Still trying to figure if the Sport Plus comes standard on a GTS. Reading conflicting info. Thanks for everyones input.
 

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Discussion Starter · #60 ·
I like the idea of "all the options you want and none that you don't need". I typically keep cars 2-3 years and have found that if you trade often try not to load a car up as its hard to recoup. I think I can live with a GTS with fewer options than the S as the GTS comes with some great goodies as is. Still trying to figure if the Sport Plus comes standard on a GTS. Reading conflicting info. Thanks for everyones input.


In the US, Sport Plus is NOT standard on any Macan.


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