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Speaking of new toys, these finally arrived at the end of last week.

IMG_3423 compressed .JPG


So the next problem that comes to mind is the wiring and to some extent, I am let down by the quality of included technical information (Mr Helix and Mr Toro I like your manuals in descending order - Mr NAV TV needs some work - a couple of photocopied pages isn't what I paid all that money for). Perhaps I can get some advice from the knowledgeable @GeO or @Santirx?

1. After looking at both the Helix SDMI25 and the NAV TV, is it a safe assumption that these devices 'wake up' (turn on) with the fibre signal from the head unit?
2. Given the assumption at 1 above (and following pictures of GeO's instal), the NAV TV gives a wake up via blue wire to the Helix through REM in, Helix REM out then gives wake up to Toro via blue wire REM in?
3. Toro is driving the Sub via the RCA Line Output of the Helix, which one of the two RCA's on the V Twelve and is this a settable item in the Helix software?
4. Noted on Santirx use of the Toro, it has two RCA in (marked as 1 and 2) and you look to have used the top (1) terminal with an adapter and two wires in lieu of an RCA cable. So why are two RCA inputs fitted if it is a mono amp (perhaps a left and right feed) ?
5. GeO, that Wi Fi add on for your V Eight, is that a convenient nice to have or am I going to miss something if I don't get one?

Yes, I appreciate that manufacturers suggest that these items be fitted by 'Eddie the expert installer', but the lack of some tech data in the instruction manual makes it difficult to us 'almost Eddies'. :mad:

Santirx, looking forward to seeing that fully painted up and labelled Option 1 sub box.
 

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Speaking of new toys, these finally arrived at the end of last week.

View attachment 235575

So the next problem that comes to mind is the wiring and to some extent, I am let down by the quality of included technical information (Mr Helix and Mr Toro I like your manuals in descending order - Mr NAV TV needs some work - a couple of photocopied pages isn't what I paid all that money for). Perhaps I can get some advice from the knowledgeable @GeO or @Santirx?

1. After looking at both the Helix SDMI25 and the NAV TV, is it a safe assumption that these devices 'wake up' (turn on) with the fibre signal from the head unit?
2. Given the assumption at 1 above (and following pictures of GeO's instal), the NAV TV gives a wake up via blue wire to the Helix through REM in, Helix REM out then gives wake up to Toro via blue wire REM in?
3. Toro is driving the Sub via the RCA Line Output of the Helix, which one of the two RCA's on the V Twelve and is this a settable item in the Helix software?
4. Noted on Santirx use of the Toro, it has two RCA in (marked as 1 and 2) and you look to have used the top (1) terminal with an adapter and two wires in lieu of an RCA cable. So why are two RCA inputs fitted if it is a mono amp (perhaps a left and right feed) ?
5. GeO, that Wi Fi add on for your V Eight, is that a convenient nice to have or am I going to miss something if I don't get one?

Yes, I appreciate that manufacturers suggest that these items be fitted by 'Eddie the expert installer', but the lack of some tech data in the instruction manual makes it difficult to us 'almost Eddies'. :mad:

Santirx, looking forward to seeing that fully painted up and labelled Option 1 sub box.
On your point # 4, I asked that question myself when I installed it. Consulted @Ge0 and he guided me, told me that they will sum up internally. Therefore, you can connect the Helix output to any of the two RCA's in the Toro and it will sum up internally. Not sure why Toro did that. And you can use any RCA cable. What I did with the two wires with RCA terminals is equivalent to an RCA wire. Good Luck!
 

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Discussion Starter #804
Speaking of new toys, these finally arrived at the end of last week.

View attachment 235575

So the next problem that comes to mind is the wiring and to some extent, I am let down by the quality of included technical information (Mr Helix and Mr Toro I like your manuals in descending order - Mr NAV TV needs some work - a couple of photocopied pages isn't what I paid all that money for). Perhaps I can get some advice from the knowledgeable @GeO or @Santirx?

1. After looking at both the Helix SDMI25 and the NAV TV, is it a safe assumption that these devices 'wake up' (turn on) with the fibre signal from the head unit?
2. Given the assumption at 1 above (and following pictures of GeO's instal), the NAV TV gives a wake up via blue wire to the Helix through REM in, Helix REM out then gives wake up to Toro via blue wire REM in?
3. Toro is driving the Sub via the RCA Line Output of the Helix, which one of the two RCA's on the V Twelve and is this a settable item in the Helix software?
4. Noted on Santirx use of the Toro, it has two RCA in (marked as 1 and 2) and you look to have used the top (1) terminal with an adapter and two wires in lieu of an RCA cable. So why are two RCA inputs fitted if it is a mono amp (perhaps a left and right feed) ?
5. GeO, that Wi Fi add on for your V Eight, is that a convenient nice to have or am I going to miss something if I don't get one?

Yes, I appreciate that manufacturers suggest that these items be fitted by 'Eddie the expert installer', but the lack of some tech data in the instruction manual makes it difficult to us 'almost Eddies'. :mad:

Santirx, looking forward to seeing that fully painted up and labelled Option 1 sub box.
Sorry about the delay Gra. I was helping my son with his Algebra homework which he is struggling with.

You don't fool around. I love your choice in amplifiers :). Oh, and an actual photo from Gra? Holy [email protected] LOL!!!

1.) Yes. This is part of the MOST buss standard. The module should sit in a ultra low current sleep state until optical buss activity is detected. It will not put significant drain on your battery.

2.) Yes and Yes. The MOST adapter will power up the main amplifier. Then, the main amplifier will power up the subwoofer amplifier. This sequence is preferred. It will eliminate subwoofer turn on pop.

3.) Yes. The Helix will have two spare DSP channels available. You assign one of these to a physical RCA output on the amp. This is pretty straight forward. If you need help with the DSP software just ask.

4.) The Toro amp will sum the two inputs internally. There are two inputs for legacy reasons. Some older equipment provides stereo subwoofer signal out (which is not required). Subwoofer frequencies are mixed and recorded in mono.

5.) Gra. I can't answer this question without knowing your use case. YES, the WiFi adapter is great if you plan on tinkering with your EQ settings a lot. It's worth the $180USD investment to me. It's a pain to string a USB cable to make changes to settings every time you want to tinker.

Also, if you have a case where you want an awesome 1 seat tuning but then have a 2nd preset for front seat passenger, and a 3rd preset for rear seat passengers then the WiFi adapter plus phone app will allow you to select between them. You also will have remote subwoofer volume control (like a wireless bass boost knob) using the phone app.

6.) Chances are you already know much more than Eddie. However, Eddie may have some installation tricks under his sleeve that make his services useful. It is at least worth contacting your Eddie and judging for yourself. Unfortunately I have no recommendations for your part of the globe. However, a lot of folks from down under frequent the DIY Mobile Audio forum. You may want to pop by there and ask...

Good night / day :).

Ge0
 

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Tomorrow I get the GB40, will be looking at a way to set them up in the door adapters. However, playing the the GB25, these speakers have a number of mounting options that make it easy to adapt...

Here with one of the adapters, which match the previously made adapter for the door.









If the GB40’s don’t work well, I already have a fall back plan with the GB25’s....


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Ah, Santirx and GeO, thank you Sirs, your comments are gratefully appreciated.

Wiring things seem much as I anticipated. On the Wi Fi bit, it looks like a 'too nice to have' as I don't anticipate a lot of playing with the software side - the hardware however, well I try to stay away from those dark dens of blue glowing sound rooms. I made it out of one last week with just the VTwelve and some useful information, also found out if I had asked the right questions I might have saved a bit on the NAV TV, but they did give me some off the V Twelve which was nice. It's looking like you two are increasingly being tempted by 'new speaker porn' but that's probably only a good thing for the rest of us on the forum. Those new speakers look fantastic, you need to find a way to make the doors see through, so you can see them all the time ... ;)

On the photo front, yes GeO it's getting used to the technology, camera at hand, take an image, download it, then master how to add it in. A word of caution here, I am following your lead and looking to start a new topic on my install, with a good word picture and lots of photos :oops:
 

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I'm curious if either of you (@Ge0 or @Santirx) have calculated the cost of the actual installed system (not including all the other speakers, amps, etc you have tried along the way). IE how much is a really nice sound upgrade going to cost you if you DIY but also don't change things out 5 times. :)
 

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I'm curious if either of you (@Ge0 or @Santirx) have calculated the cost of the actual installed system (not including all the other speakers, amps, etc you have tried along the way). IE how much is a really nice sound upgrade going to cost you if you DIY but also don't change things out 5 times. :)

Already done some time ago... Check post # 622 in the following link: Macan BOSE to BURMESTER Speaker Swap
 

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Ah, Santirx and GeO, thank you Sirs, your comments are gratefully appreciated.

Wiring things seem much as I anticipated. On the Wi Fi bit, it looks like a 'too nice to have' as I don't anticipate a lot of playing with the software side - the hardware however, well I try to stay away from those dark dens of blue glowing sound rooms. I made it out of one last week with just the VTwelve and some useful information, also found out if I had asked the right questions I might have saved a bit on the NAV TV, but they did give me some off the V Twelve which was nice. It's looking like you two are increasingly being tempted by 'new speaker porn' but that's probably only a good thing for the rest of us on the forum. Those new speakers look fantastic, you need to find a way to make the doors see through, so you can see them all the time ... ;)

On the photo front, yes GeO it's getting used to the technology, camera at hand, take an image, download it, then master how to add it in. A word of caution here, I am following your lead and looking to start a new topic on my install, with a good word picture and lots of photos :oops:
@Gra, I was browsing a PIWIS computer I have access to, and found the following for 2017 Macan... I have access to a lot of diagrams, including the Bose system.

Sorry I didn’t realize this before, but hope is timely for you, as you wire your car. I wished I had found this before you had to manually confirm all wires, but the access to this system was limited for some time.

Let me know if you need me to zoom to any other particular part of the diagram.











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Santirx, what a wee ripper (as a famous Scotsman over here once said). :giggle: (y)

Thanks for that, I have copied and printed two pages and will compare them with the list I have made out after making a chart up by physically checking (continuity) each wire through from connector to speaker (yes, pulling the door skins, dash and D pillar covers off 😕). The second last image above of the connector, plus the three items to the right side (speakers) would not enhance enough for me to read it. But by tracing the wiring, I note they are (from L to R) - Surround back left, Subwoofer and Surround back right.

Just finalising the wiring layout now, the first test fit worked out well and some light tidying will see it ready to go. It's a tight fit of the three units into the space where two normally reside.
 

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@Gra, Try this file attached (22_EN.pdf)... It is the full wire diagram of the Bose amplifier in PDF. It prints it in 3 pages, so you'll have to stitch them together, somehow.

You only see the subwoofer and surround speakers in this diagram, because they are near the amplifier.

For the rest, I have to follow the wires and that will take me to different locations. In example, pin A19 in the amplifier will take me to the full wiring diagram of the rear left door (see 09C_EN.pdf, as an example of that rear left door diagram), including speaker wiring. It gets very complicated sending all these diagrams, so I hope that the amplifier diagram is enough. However, if you need any specific one, let me know and I'll see what I can do.
 

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@Santirx, absolute Antz Pantz Sir, many thanks for that. Checked your first sheet from yesterday against mine and noted only one minor transcription error on my sheet, plus they learnt how to spell 'Ring Break Diagnosis', the one on the previous (pre 2016) diagram on the Forum got itself confused with a Brake - odd because the German words for Break and Brake are completely different and should not lead to translation problems. Either way, providing the fibre optic line is inserted correctly it should not be diagnosing a break in the loop!

Here is the chart I did up from my work,
Porsche Macan 2017 Bose Wiring Scan.jpeg
 

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These arrived today...
235613


After looking at them and trying to plan their installation, I was almost sure they would not fit...

I shaved about 1mm from the inner hole of the two adapters and that was sufficient for the cone rubber to clear.

235614



Had to be creative with the screw positioning and installation on the adapter...
235615


Now to the most difficult part, the part that I was dreading the most about the install... installing wires in the terminals... I installed ferrules and was very careful not to overtorque and not to damage the screws... SUCCESS!! Getting the hang of it...
235616


235617


I was able to successfully install them...

Now, how they sound? Very natural. More details in the sound revealed. The tone is very good. No resonance/distortion.

I installed one, while keeping the JL C5 on the other door, to compare. There was a sizable difference between the two, enough to be noticeable. Decided to install the other GB40 and removed both JL C5. They blend very well with the GB25 in the center location.

Loving them so far. They are truly great speakers.

I think I’m an Audiofrog convert.

EDIT: Tested some more today during commute. I can’t get over the sound details. These speakers, both the GB25 and the GB40 are very good speakers. This now got me thinking about potentially “upgrading” my tweeters for the GB10’s. But not sure how those would compare with the AV1.1. I imagine the GB10’s are superior based on my comparison between the AV midrange series with the AF GB midrange series.

Really smooth sound.
 

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@Santirx, absolute Antz Pantz Sir, many thanks for that. Checked your first sheet from yesterday against mine and noted only one minor transcription error on my sheet, plus they learnt how to spell 'Ring Break Diagnosis', the one on the previous (pre 2016) diagram on the Forum got itself confused with a Brake - odd because the German words for Break and Brake are completely different and should not lead to translation problems. Either way, providing the fibre optic line is inserted correctly it should not be diagnosing a break in the loop!

Here is the chart I did up from my work,
View attachment 235605
That's a cool chart/diagram. Well done.
 

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Discussion Starter #815
These arrived today...
View attachment 235613

After looking at them and trying to plan their installation, I was almost sure they would not fit...

I shaved about 1mm from the inner hole of the two adapters and that was sufficient for the cone rubber to clear.

View attachment 235614


Had to be creative with the screw installation on the adapter...
View attachment 235615

Now to the most difficult part, the part that I was dreading the most about the install... installing wires in the terminals... I installed ferrules and was very careful not to overtorque and not to damage the screws... SUCCESS!! Getting the hang of it...
View attachment 235616

View attachment 235617

I was able to successfully install them...

Now, how they sound? Very natural. More details in the sound revealed. The tone is very good. No resonance/distortion.

I installed one, while keeping the JL C5 on the other door, to compare. There was a sizable difference between the two, enough to be noticeable. Decided to install the other GB40 and removed both JL C5. They blend very well with the GB25 in the center location.

Loving them so far. They are truly great speakers.

I think I’m an Audiofrog convert.

EDIT: Tested some more today during commute. I can’t get over the sound details. These speakers, both the GB25 and the GB40 are very good speakers. This now got me thinking about potentially “upgrading” my tweeters for the GB10’s. But not sure how those would compare with the AV1.1. I imagine the GB10’s are superior based on my comparison between the AV midrange series with the AF GB midrange series.

Really smooth sound.
Oh I definitely have you hooked :). You gotta try the GB10's.

When you get serious about hearing detail in your music try these :)

235642


235643


I wish My garage was attached, heated, and well lit. I'm anxious to install. But, have something else to try first...

Ge0
 

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Started the sub box process yesterday, and made some good progress.

I didn't snap enough pics, but I opted for 3/4" MDF and kerfs for the curved section. Fill in the kerfs with resin and overlaid with fiberglass mesh and I think it's pretty much bomb-proof.

Unfortunately, I miscalculated the size of the JL sub I was planning to use, so instead of redoing the box I picked up a Focal EVO sub which should work just fine. Sub should be here on Friday, so I can finish the assembly then.
 

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Started the sub box process yesterday, and made some good progress.

I didn't snap enough pics, but I opted for 3/4" MDF and kerfs for the curved section. Fill in the kerfs with resin and overlaid with fiberglass mesh and I think it's pretty much bomb-proof.

Unfortunately, I miscalculated the size of the JL sub I was planning to use, so instead of redoing the box I picked up a Focal EVO sub which should work just fine. Sub should be here on Friday, so I can finish the assembly then.
Looking good there @Draper. Can’t wait to see it finished. Is that an 8 or 10” sub?


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Oh I definitely have you hooked :). You gotta try the GB10's.

When you get serious about hearing detail in your music try these :)

View attachment 235642

View attachment 235643

I wish My garage was attached, heated, and well lit. I'm anxious to install. But, have something else to try first...

Ge0
I’m sure you’ll let us know if they are better than your ScanSpeak. These are very expensive midrange speakers (almost twice the cost of the GB40). I wonder if the quality gain is commensurate to the cost.

These are as expensive as the DynAudio.

Also, I though you didn’t like those French speakers... . They look fantastic though.

I can’t continue to go down this rabbit hole. I think I’m ending the upgrades with the GB10’s. I mean, the system sound is so great now.

But... that’s what I said last time... Not trusting myself lately in this area...


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Discussion Starter #820
Started the sub box process yesterday, and made some good progress.

I didn't snap enough pics, but I opted for 3/4" MDF and kerfs for the curved section. Fill in the kerfs with resin and overlaid with fiberglass mesh and I think it's pretty much bomb-proof.

Unfortunately, I miscalculated the size of the JL sub I was planning to use, so instead of redoing the box I picked up a Focal EVO sub which should work just fine. Sub should be here on Friday, so I can finish the assembly then.
Holy cow! You did all those kerfs with a hand held circular saw? Mad skills. Looks good. It will be interesting to see everyone's solution for the same / similar sub enclosure.

Ge0
 
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