Porsche Macan Forum banner

421 - 440 of 566 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
14 Posts
I think we need to consider 2 different things

Porsche engineers calculated the torque for expansion screws torque + degree
- Aluminium bolts are delivered by external companies in thousands

1. Aluminium expansion screws might have been overtorqued by assembling
2. Aluminium material might not be correct (Bolts quality issue)
3. Left and Right outer side front plate screws are affected (above them the Cam cover is mounted)
3. Since we don't exactly know in which moment the bolts break ... we have no clue why and when this happens
4. The broken bolts have been seen on new cars with small mileage
5. My Macan Turbo had broken screws outer left and right side of front plate at ~ 51k - 59k km (maybe was much earlier but not identified earlier)
6. Many Macans do not have this issue at all
7. From engineering perspective Porsche calculated the torque + degree for the bolts material and size
8. My conclusion would be in this case rather more a material issue (The wrenches at Porsche are usually computer checked and audited)
9. My conclusion could be wrong as well :D
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
6,256 Posts
10. All is up to luck now.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
114 Posts
Just following up on my experience. Had my car serviced and they found no signs of leaks. The interesting thing is that I ended up taking my car to the same dealer that the previous owner took it to a few years prior. Probing the service history my SA was able to find out that my transfer case was replaced about 2-3 years ago at 17k miles. My assumption is that is what caused the staining on the under tray. I think I dodged a bullet on this one. With my exhaust issue fixed car is running super smooth and rattle free!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
17 Posts
Add me to the list of folks with an oil leak 2017 S with about 22K miles. Appointment with the dealership next week to diagnose.

IMG_20200201_092658.jpg IMG_20200201_092646.jpg
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
388 Posts
I think we need to consider 2 different things

Porsche engineers calculated the torque for expansion screws torque + degree
- Aluminium bolts are delivered by external companies in thousands

1. Aluminium expansion screws might have been overtorqued by assembling
2. Aluminium material might not be correct (Bolts quality issue)
3. Left and Right outer side front plate screws are affected (above them the Cam cover is mounted)
3. Since we don't exactly know in which moment the bolts break ... we have no clue why and when this happens
4. The broken bolts have been seen on new cars with small mileage
5. My Macan Turbo had broken screws outer left and right side of front plate at ~ 51k - 59k km (maybe was much earlier but not identified earlier)
6. Many Macans do not have this issue at all
7. From engineering perspective Porsche calculated the torque + degree for the bolts material and size
8. My conclusion would be in this case rather more a material issue (The wrenches at Porsche are usually computer checked and audited)
9. My conclusion could be wrong as well :D
I would just point out the vast majority of Macans including many high mileage units don’t have this issue. Of course that is of little consolation if yours does. Sort of reminds me of the IMS issue from 15-20 years ago.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
67 Posts
I'm not so sure mileage has much to do with it. I observed the leak on mine the first time I had it on my lift at 10k miles. Also saw oil drips on garage floor. It took another 40k miles and four dealer visits to two different dealers before they "saw" the drip. In my case I did not observe the leak to be any worse at 10k miles, than it was at almost 50k miles. Let's hope PCNA is smart enough to handle this better than the 996 issue, however it did put some companies on the map such as Flat 6 and LN Engineering since Porsche could not have a design issue.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
153 Posts
Was just talking to a couple of Porsche technicians about the timing chain cover leaks. They said a seap may not necessarily turn into a leak. Do you guys buy that?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,908 Posts
Seap=Leak

This is an excuse to not have to fix a known problem.

It is a significant amount of work with engine removal (the only proper method of fixing this TC oil leak)
I don't think the Service Dept. makes enough $$$ by doing this under warranty bc Porsche pays them less than when owner pays.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mplgaus

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
2,190 Posts
seep: to flow or pass slowly through fine pores or small openings: ooze

leak: to enter or escape through an opening usually by a fault or mistake; to let a substance or light in or out through an opening


A seep is a slow leak - it's not dripping or pouring, it's slowly seeping or oozing out. Eventually a drop will form and at some point
the drop will drip off.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
215 Posts
Seap=Leak

This is an excuse to not have to fix a known problem.

It is a significant amount of work with engine removal (the only proper method of fixing this TC oil leak)
I don't think the Service Dept. makes enough $$$ by doing this under warranty bc Porsche pays them less than when owner pays.
While it’s true the warranty labor rate is less than retail, dealers (and techs) are doing just fine on warranty work. Any good tech can beat the flat rate book by a significant margin.

What’s going on here is PCNA is pushing back on paying huge expenses to rectify minor weepage issues. Can’t say I blame them.

But if anyone feels their engine should have zero weepage, by all means don’t accept their answer and take it up with PCNA. On the other hand, if you have a broken bolt, no question that’s a defect that’s covered under warranty. If they won’t properly repair that, make it very clear to them they are not going to get away with it and that you intend to let the whole world know that the dealer and PCNA does not honor their warranty and take legal action against them including reimbursement of your legal expenses.

Lots of Porsche owners have the financial means to litigate this, they know that, and that’s not the direction they want to go. European manufacturers are absolutely apprehensive about the way U.S. courts work.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,733 Posts
While it’s true the warranty labor rate is less than retail, dealers (and techs) are doing just fine on warranty work. Any good tech can beat the flat rate book by a significant margin.

What’s going on here is PCNA is pushing back on paying huge expenses to rectify minor weepage issues. Can’t say I blame them.

But if anyone feels their engine should have zero weepage, by all means don’t accept their answer and take it up with PCNA. On the other hand, if you have a broken bolt, no question that’s a defect that’s covered under warranty. If they won’t properly repair that, make it very clear to them they are not going to get away with it and that you intend to let the whole world know that the dealer and PCNA does not honor their warranty and take legal action against them including reimbursement of your legal expenses.

Lots of Porsche owners have the financial means to litigate this, they know that, and that’s not the direction they want to go. European manufacturers are absolutely apprehensive about the way U.S. courts work.
Ford just published it's annual report, and I thought you might find the verbiage regarding warranties interesting:

We provide warranties on the vehicles we sell. Warranties are offered for specific periods of time and/or mileage and vary depending upon the type of product and the geographic location of its sale. Pursuant to these warranties, we will repair, replace, or adjust all parts on a vehicle that are defective in factory-supplied materials or workmanship during the specified warranty period. We are a defendant in numerous actions in state and federal courts alleging damages based on state and federal consumer protection laws and breach of warranty obligations. Remedies under these statutes may include vehicle repurchase, civil penalties, and plaintiff’s attorney fees. In some cases, plaintiffs also include an allegation of fraud. Remedies for a fraud claim may include contract rescission, vehicle repurchase, and punitive damages.

The cost of these matters is included in our warranty costs. We accrue obligations for warranty costs at the time of sale using a patterned estimation model that includes historical information regarding the nature, frequency, and average cost of claims for each vehicle line by model year. We reevaluate the adequacy of our accruals on a regular basis.
 
  • Like
Reactions: grim

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,908 Posts
I misspelled "Seep."

FWIW, I do not think either I should Seep or Leak nor should my cars.

;)
 
  • Like
Reactions: mplgaus and Shark

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
8,947 Posts
The cost of these matters is included in our warranty costs.
Sounds like the cost of the warranty is included in the cost of the car. Just like that "free maintenance" is including in the upfront cost of the car? So everyone pays for someone's broken car.

Nothing is free.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
6,256 Posts
Does it cover those cars out of the factory warranty? I cannot download the file.
 
421 - 440 of 566 Posts
Top