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Honestly, I am not comparing it to my GT3RS. I simply threw that name out there to explain thats a car I own with a PDK transmission. Its not like I am replacing the GT3RS with the Macan:)

I also want to emphasize that my gripes with this car isn't about its size, or ride height, or handling. It actually does those things surprisingly well. My complaints are I think mostly around throttle response and transmission.

I did a 100 mile drive today, around 60% highway, 30% freeway, rest stop and go city traffic. I think there is a substantial throttle lag but I am not sure if this is coming from the built in gas pedal numbness OR the small V6 engine OR the transmission (OR a bit of all of them). But I find myself literally getting nervous not as easily navigate a busy highway. Once you put your foot down, there are several seconds of gap until the car truly takes off. I think the pedal has some programming in it that has a dead spot, plus the engine isn't that responsive (I can see turbo boost building up after a bit), and the PDK is really very different than the PDKs you see in the 911s. It holds the gears too long or takes too long to downshift.

These issues really have nothing to do with this being an SUV or weighing 4,400 lbs or the name being Macan. I think its a combination of the programming + engine + transmission. If the three variables were present in a 911, I'd be complaining the same way. I don't think an SUV should be like this just because it's an SUV. You want the gas pedal to be as responsive as possible.

In terms of cornering, braking, and even steering response are really not areas of concern. I have done some research here in this forum and it looks like my complaints aren't really unique, these are known issues with this car.

Once the car gets going, it actually can gain speed and does not run out of power. But the time it takes to respond to your input is really unacceptable. I am not sure how much better the GTS is. I guess I should try to find an old Macan Turbo.
You really need to get out in a 2.9l version, I think it will solve much of your worries. There's still some lag but it's much more responsive...are there any members close by that have one?
 

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You really need to get out in a 2.9l version, I think it will solve much of your worries. There's still some lag but it's much more responsive...are there any members close by that have one?
And that’s because of the hot V setup I’d imagine?
 

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Discussion Starter · #46 ·
Nope thats the 3.0 l V6. I did a comparison to the old S here ( mind you its Aussie spec, but engines are the same). Macan S 2021 vs 2022 (Gen 2 vs Gen 3)
I am not following this. The smaller the engine displacement, the more boost turbos will need to make. The more boost the more turbo lag.

This does not mean the final horsepower cannot be more, it can (i.e Nissan Skyline lol), so those improved 0-100 numbers are accurate but the overall driving experience might be impacted negatively.

This is why larger displacement twin turbo V8s have much less turbo lag because they make substantially more torque without turbos.
 

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I am not following this. The smaller the engine displacement, the more boost turbos will need to make. The more boost the more turbo lag.

This does not mean the final horsepower cannot be more, it can (i.e Nissan Skyline lol), so those improved 0-100 numbers are accurate but the overall driving experience might be impacted negatively.

This is why larger displacement twin turbo V8s have much less turbo lag because they make substantially more torque without turbos.
There's more to spool time than just engine size. The hot V design with shorter paths to the turbos mean exhaust pressure gets there faster. Design of header lengths can synchronize pulses that get to the turbo so they arrive as smoothly as possible one after another. Turbo impeller size and design can be adjusted for faster spool and certainly two smaller turbos will spool faster than one big one (like the 3.0l IIRC). There's a lot of engineering that goes into engine intake/exhaust/turbo design.

Also, 0.1 liter is very minimal in terms of displacement, we're talking like 3-4%. Now all things equal, if they increased the 2.9l up to 3.0l but left everything else the same, it would spool a little bit faster and have a bit more low end torque. The 2.9l and 3.0l though are not from the same family and are different designs entirely.

And that’s because of the hot V setup I’d imagine?
Amongst other things as noted above.
 

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There’s been some talking about a few seconds of turbo lag, which is unacceptable in any car. Is that real? And for which model year/Macan trims?

My 2015 S with the 3.0L V6 turbo engine does have some turbo lag in normal driving mode, but it’s not a few seconds. If in sport mode the turbo lag neatly disappears.
 

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There’s been some talking about a few seconds of turbo lag, which is unacceptable in any car. Is that real? And for which model year/Macan trims?

My 2015 S with the 3.0L V6 turbo engine does have some turbo lag in normal driving mode, but it’s not a few seconds. If in sport mode the turbo lag neatly disappears.
It's not actually a few seconds...but it sure feels that way when you put your foot down and it takes a moment for things to happen. I'd suspect the difference in spool time is actually only a few hundred milliseconds.
 

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I am considering the Macan GTS (2022). I am currently driving a loaner (2021 Macan S)....how much better is going to be GTS? Is it like a completely different car?
The GTS is incrementally better than the Macan S in many respects. But in my opinion, the GTS is not going to be a dramatically different car than your loaner S. If you buy the GTS sight unseen, I expect that you'll be disappointed.

In our case, we drive a Turbo. It has the optional carbon ceramic brakes. Its air suspension has been dropped 25mm below the GTS ride height. It as PTV+, and we saved a little weight by not getting the pano roof. It is a joy to drive. We've had it 7 years now, and will likely keep it another 7 years. But with that said, when we get a Base 2.0 loaner Macan while ours is in for service, the loaner car feels shockingly similar for typical around town driving.

The GTS is a terrific compact SUV. And with a lower ride height, it feels a little closer to a sports sedan. But based on the concerns you've posted, it may not be the beast you're look for. Definitely don't buy one without first driving one.

Just my two cents.
 
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The GTS is incrementally better than the Macan S in many respects. But in my opinion, the GTS is not going to be a dramatically different car than your loaner S. If you buy the GTS sight unseen, I expect that you'll be disappointed.

In our case, we drive a Turbo. It has the optional carbon ceramic brakes. Its air suspension has been dropped 25mm below the GTS ride height. It as PTV+, and we saved a little weight by not getting the pano roof. It is a joy to drive. We've had it 7 years now, and will likely keep it another 7 years. But with that said, when we get a Base 2.0 loaner Macan while ours is in for service, the loaner car feels shockingly similar for typical around town driving.

The GTS is a terrific compact SUV. And with a lower ride height, it feels a little closer to a sports sedan. But based on the concerns you've posted, it may not be the beast you're look for. Definitely don't buy one without first driving one.

Just my two cents.
The 2021 S vs the 2022 GTS is going to be a substantial jump. Remember the 2022 GTS is getting the tune from the outgoing Turbo, so 434hp.
 

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Discussion Starter · #52 · (Edited)
The 2021 S vs the 2022 GTS is going to be a substantial jump. Remember the 2022 GTS is getting the tune from the outgoing Turbo, so 434hp.
But the question isnt about power. Its about the overall driving dynamics around :

  • Throttle response
  • Transmission response
  • Sound

Two cars can be 250 hp apart, one doing 13s the other 11s 1/4 mile. The faster car will be super fast once the throttle response lag is past and the transmission figures out its thing.

The problem that I am inquiring about isnt will it be faster but it is rather “will it still have the throttle lag/transmission lag/and also the really super underwhelming sound”.

In manual mode driving in canyons (which I think some of you do), this isnt an issue. It is an issue when you are driving at highway speeds and need to quickly change lanes/past people and you do this several times in a 10-15 minute span. The combination of the lag factors make this a very annoying experience.

Then there is the sound. I dont know how much louder/better GTS is than S. But the way this car sounds is very uninspiring. I am not comparing it to V8 but rather M2 Comp I drove or F80 M3 both are 6 cylinders.
 

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Drive your loaner S in manual shifting mode for a day in all traffic situations. i have a feeling you won’t experience the lag that is ever present in automatic shift mode. After following this forum for a few days I went out to my S to see when I was experiencing lag and how to minimize it. Manual shifting kept me in the sweet rpm spot where turbo lag is not present. I notice the automatic transmission in normal mode leans more toward efficiency with low rpm up shifts when driving casually….when I want to zip off it feels like car it take a second to spool up. The car feels more surgical in manual mode.
 

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I also wasn't thrilled with the lag in the current S; this C&D review suggests things should be better in the 2022 with the 2.9 version. Describes decent response at lower thresholds -- see if this gives you the insight you're looking for.
C&D Review

But the question isnt about power. Its about the overall driving dynamics around :

  • Throttle response
  • Transmission response
  • Sound

Two cars can be 250 hp apart, one doing 13s the other 11s 1/4 mile. The faster car will be super fast once the throttle response lag is past and the transmission figures out its thing.

The problem that I am inquiring about isnt will it be faster but it is rather “will it still have the throttle lag/transmission lag/and also the really super underwhelming sound”.
 

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My current daily driver is a shelby GT350 that has over 72,000 miles on the clock. Its around 560 hp and weight is little under 3700 lbs (I have some mods). I understand no SUV will match the performance of this car and maybe I am really spoiled but the time has come that I can no longer make it work with the GT350 and I need a bigger car for the family.

Now, given above, how much better is going to be GTS? Is it like a completely different car? The GTS I have built is 104k MSRP with every driveterrain option and decent amount of other things like burmeister. The loaner I have is 73k MSRP with no driveterrain options. I understand GTS has different tuning for steering, suspension, new one has more power, and has the sport exhaust but I am really worried the sound of the engine is going to be a total let down. It does not sound like BMW's Inline 6 for example. Both are turbo charged 6 cylinders but this one is just too quiet.

My other option is to spend another 35k and get a Cayenne GTS. It does sound better but I'm not sure if driving dynamics will be acceptable.
As you've clarified yourself throughout this thread, I don't think the Macan is what you're looking for. Matter fact, I don't think Porsche is what you're looking for. You've stated multiple times now that you don't necessarily care about the best steering feel, or the best brake feel or overall composure of the vehicle in aggressive corners. You said you want a fast family hauler that's comfortable, has good response and is acceptable in the areas I mentioned prior. At the same time you mentioned not spending more than you have to to get those items. I feel Porsche SUVs try to balance a lot of things but to get a fast V8 family hauler from them is very expensive.

At the price point you built up that Macan GTS that puts you into a XM5 "class" which is exactly what you're looking for. This means vehicles like the X5M, X6M and slightly cheaper M50i versions as well as the SQ7/SQ8. I would add a GLC63 and Trackhawk to the list but 2021 is the last year for both so you'd have to buy a marked up off the lot model. These are all V8 TT with good response, fairly quick to fast, comfortable, nice interiors and OK driving dynamics.

In regards to SUV performance compared to your GT350 and if by performance you're talking acceleration as well as overall engine/transmission feel then you have nothing to worry about. A GT350 with basic mods and a E tune is only 500whp and just barely over 400wtq. A stock X5M for example is basically just as fast and if you put a tuner on it then it's easily faster with low 600s for whp/wtq. I was going to mention the 6cyc TT like the X3M and Stelvio Q but I don't think those are what you're looking for. The X3M is fast though if you like something smaller with loads of power. My E30 flash is just touching 620whp. It's a rocket on the expressway.
 

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As you've clarified yourself throughout this thread, I don't think the Macan is what you're looking for. Matter fact, I don't think Porsche is what you're looking for. You've stated multiple times now that you don't necessarily care about the best steering feel, or the best brake feel or overall composure of the vehicle in aggressive corners. You said you want a fast family hauler that's comfortable, has good response and is acceptable in the areas I mentioned prior. At the same time you mentioned not spending more than you have to to get those items. I feel Porsche SUVs try to balance a lot of things but to get a fast V8 family hauler from them is very expensive.

At the price point you built up that Macan GTS that puts you into a XM5 "class" which is exactly what you're looking for. This means vehicles like the X5M, X6M and slightly cheaper M50i versions as well as the SQ7/SQ8. I would add a GLC63 and Trackhawk to the list but 2021 is the last year for both so you'd have to buy a marked up off the lot model. These are all V8 TT with good response, fairly quick to fast, comfortable, nice interiors and OK driving dynamics.

In regards to SUV performance compared to your GT350 and if by performance you're talking acceleration as well as overall engine/transmission feel then you have nothing to worry about. A GT350 with basic mods and a E tune is only 500whp and just barely over 400wtq. A stock X5M for example is basically just as fast and if you put a tuner on it then it's easily faster with low 600s for whp/wtq. I was going to mention the 6cyc TT like the X3M and Stelvio Q but I don't think those are what you're looking for. The X3M is fast though if you like something smaller with loads of power. My E30 flash is just touching 620whp. It's a rocket on the expressway.
Good summary - I would agree, I don’t think Macan is his car.
 

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Tough to live up to 991.2GT3 RS standards, especially for an SUV ;) I cannot specifically speak to the new 2022 Macan GTS as I have not driven it and there are only a few reviews out at the moment. But if it is similar to the "old" Macan Turbo Performance Package (both 440 hp albeit different engines) I think it would be a great car.

You cannot defy physics but the car handles great and has enough power for most people. But maybe you don't fall into that category if you need to replace a GT 350. But overall the Macan delivers the best bang for the buck in the Porsche lineup. A Cayenne GTS will be considerably more expensive and is a bigger car, so despite more hp won't have the same handling I think. My 2 cents.
Ha! I have a gt3rs and a 22 Macan GTS. Can’t compare the two but the Macan is fun to drive. I always put it in Sport Mode and “the button” works great too.
 

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I am considering the Macan GTS (2022). I am currently driving a loaner (2021 Macan S) as my 991.2 GT3RS is in service and I am rather underwhelmed. My current daily driver is a shelby GT350 that has over 72,000 miles on the clock. Its around 560 hp and weight is little under 3700 lbs (I have some mods). I understand no SUV will match the performance of this car and maybe I am really spoiled but the time has come that I can no longer make it work with the GT350 and I need a bigger car for the family.

Basically, I need to figure out how much better the GTS is vs the S and whether I have unrealistic expectations. I watch all these review videos (including the TheSmokingTire review) and they make this car appear amazing - which may be it is, but I dont know how much better it is than the Macan S I am driving. Here are my concerns, impressions:

  • Power : Very very underwhelming. This car has 362 hp and I know the new GTS will have 80 hp more but the speed sort of dies off past 65 mph.
  • Turbo lag : Tremendous turbo lag, I can count "one mississippi, two mississippi" before hitting the gas pedal and the car really start taking off.
  • Transmission : It is not like the PDK in my RS! Its like a completely different transmission. It holds the gears too long or does not downshift quickly. Its really clunky and guesses. In manual mode, the upshifts are really too soft (The ZF8 in the BMW M5 is much harsher upshifts for example), downshifts are too mild
  • Wind noise : Tremendous wind noise at 75 mph and gets progressively worse. You cant drive this car at 95 mph for example for several minutes.
  • Suspension : This car does not have the air suspension and I know that helps but it rides like a brick on wheels. Too stiff and damping is really poor. Too much body roll.
  • Sound : I cannot hear the engine! I actually at first thought this car has 2 liter 4 cylinder engine due to how quite it was. It does not have the support exhaust button but upon close inspection, I do see an exhaust valve in the muffler that opens up.
  • Steering: Too vague, too imprecise. Too much slack when its at 12 o'clock. It doesnt have that Porsche magic (that I have on my RS).

All driving above was done with "Sport" mode on.

Now, given above, how much better is going to be GTS? Is it like a completely different car? The GTS I have built is 104k MSRP with every driveterrain option and decent amount of other things like burmeister. The loaner I have is 73k MSRP with no driveterrain options. I understand GTS has different tuning for steering, suspension, new one has more power, and has the sport exhaust but I am really worried the sound of the engine is going to be a total let down. It does not sound like BMW's Inline 6 for example. Both are turbo charged 6 cylinders but this one is just too quiet.

My other option is to spend another 35k and get a Cayenne GTS. It does sound better but I'm not sure if driving dynamics will be acceptable.

Thank you
Why is it you believe a GT3RS should be compared against a luxury 4 door SAV? That isn't a comparison at all. Its like Comparing Shaq to Arnold Palmer and saying Arnold just doesn't rebound well enough!?
 

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Not mentioned is what a Cobb tune can do. It made my old 2015 Macan S into a real tiger with very little turbo lag. Night and day difference.
 
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