Four 911s on the Autobahn - Page 2 - Porsche Macan Forum
User Tag List

 16Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
post #11 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-20-2019, 01:34 PM
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: USA
Posts: 6,893
Mentioned: 1318 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3615 Post(s)
Default

Correct How to Survive the German Autobahn

Autobahn construction is superior to any one interstates.
fritz likes this.
grim is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #12 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-20-2019, 01:42 PM
Senior Member
 
gfspencer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 548
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 153 Post(s)
Default

Also Germany makes it hard to get a regular driver's license and even harder to get a motorcycle license.

2018 Porsche Macan Sport Edition Black
2017 Triumph Bobber Black
gfspencer is offline  
post #13 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-20-2019, 01:48 PM
Senior Member
 
ABusLux's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Geneva, Switzerland
Posts: 1,963
Mentioned: 120 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 603 Post(s)
Garage
Default

Ah, the Autobahn... when I went to the Hockenheimring last year on my 991.2 GTS, driving fast on a no-speed limit stretch, and I pulled over to let a Macan pass by.
fritz, wwahl and Yadkin like this.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
ABusLux is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #14 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-20-2019, 02:01 PM
Senior Member
 
Yadkin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 384
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 136 Post(s)
Garage
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by grim View Post
Correct How to Survive the German Autobahn

Autobahn construction is superior to any one interstates.
Your link states that "The autobahn is 27 inches thick", and I've seen 68 cm in other sources, so I beleive that is correct. However it incorrectly states that the "United States freeway system ... is 11 inches thick". According to this source the concrete is 11" thick, and the subbase is 21, for a total of 32". It's been a long while since I worked on interstate road design (asphalt pavements), but as I recall the constructed thickness was at least that.

There is no question that German super-highways are smoother than their US equivalent. Ireland's roads were too when I drove there about three years ago. I'm not sure why that is; my guess is quality control. Some of the newly constructed roads here are not smooth at all.

There is no question that German drivers are better trained and disciplined than they are here in the US. I'm sure we could fill this thread with 5000 pages of examples of left lane hogs, crappy equipment, distracted and rude drivers. But all that is "fixable", especially in a state like Texas.
ABusLux and gfspencer like this.

2018 Macan Sports Edition, daily driver.
Yadkin is offline  
post #15 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-20-2019, 05:13 PM
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: USA
Posts: 6,893
Mentioned: 1318 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3615 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yadkin View Post
Your link states that "The autobahn is 27 inches thick", and I've seen 68 cm in other sources, so I beleive that is correct. However it incorrectly states that the "United States freeway system ... is 11 inches thick". According to this source the concrete is 11" thick, and the subbase is 21, for a total of 32". It's been a long while since I worked on interstate road design (asphalt pavements), but as I recall the constructed thickness was at least that.

There is no question that German super-highways are smoother than their US equivalent. Ireland's roads were too when I drove there about three years ago. I'm not sure why that is; my guess is quality control. Some of the newly constructed roads here are not smooth at all.

There is no question that German drivers are better trained and disciplined than they are here in the US. I'm sure we could fill this thread with 5000 pages of examples of left lane hogs, crappy equipment, distracted and rude drivers. But all that is "fixable", especially in a state like Texas.
https://www.crainsdetroit.com/articl...-a-hefty-price from 1999 talking about Michigan

"Europeans generally dig the road about 3 feet deep, compared with only 18 inches in Michigan. That gives the road more support and a better foundation. In addition, European roads are paved with a better grade of concrete.

As a result, European pavement tends to hold up longer and require less maintenance. Unlike Michigan's roads, European roads' deeper base and more durable concrete prevent water from seeping into the pavement, which causes potholes and cracks to form.

``Instead of spending all the attention on the road's surface, Europeans are obsessed with making sure the road has a good foundation,'"

This is consistent with the other contention I've read that the Germans built the autobahn first, then got the cars whereas the in the US the US had the cars and no Interstate system.

``In the U.S., it's acceptable to let the roads be patched up, where in Europe, it's not an option,'' Jacob said. ``They resurface a road in five years regardless if it has holes. Their road standards are well above our minimum standards.''

That about says it all. It also appears to be two layers of concrete while the US one layer. http://www.worldhighways.com/categor...crete-surface/

Regardless, R&P will likely not be returning to the US. Its mostly the safety and people issues. By 1959, R&P was done to NV only. Drunk driving was about as important as a red light ticket. Cars were death traps. There was no distracted driving. And the alcohol limit was .15. Today, never going to happen because of safety mandates and people problems. People are people. They will drive at 110 while talking on the phone.

You know 911s never had cupholder? You don't drink or eat anything while driving. There is a famous story on reddit where the PCNA had to tell Stuttgart to put cupholders in the Cayenne. Take a look at the cupholders in a 911 or the boxster, complete afterthoughts. Spill a drink, hit a bump and liquid is all over the console. You are not supposed to be using them. Drivers drive, not drink coffee. Its a different world. And with deaths per VMT increasing, likely because of not using seat belts and cell phones, I wouldn't hold my breath.
fritz likes this.
grim is offline  
post #16 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-20-2019, 06:55 PM
Senior Member
 
Yadkin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 384
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 136 Post(s)
Garage
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by grim View Post
They must be talking about state highways, not interstate standards. Although I'm not disagreeing with the jist of the article- European roads are better built and maintained- there are many details discussed that are simply incorrect, and that puts others (the stated depth of only 18") in question. For example, the best concrete roads are made with no expansion joints (the article calls the sections between joints "panels" a term I've never heard used for roads) yet the article advocates for more joints.

2018 Macan Sports Edition, daily driver.
Yadkin is offline  
post #17 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-20-2019, 11:54 PM
Senior Member
 
Skinsfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Deep in the Heart of Texas
Posts: 1,129
Mentioned: 35 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 434 Post(s)
Garage
Default

That sure is one large trailer the Q5 is pulling in the far right lane at the beginning of the video.

2017 Macan Turbo PP in Carmine Red (Lipstick Red) with Turbo Exterior Package, all the performance options and lots of other stuff, Opti-Coat Pro+, Expel Ultimate, COBB Stage 1 tune, Flat6 High Flow Air Filters, 502hp/557tq (dyno verified) - aka "Redneck Sled". First Macan - 2015 Macan S in Agate Grey with Epel Ultimate. Lowered with H&R Sport Springs and tuned with a Race Chip.
Skinsfan is offline  
post #18 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-21-2019, 04:38 PM
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: USA
Posts: 6,893
Mentioned: 1318 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3615 Post(s)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yadkin View Post
They must be talking about state highways, not interstate standards. .
Could be. Here are several DOT studies of EU roads from the 90s. https://international.fhwa.dot.gov/P...rotour92-6.pdf and https://international.fhwa.dot.gov/Pdfs/Eurotour.pdf. Consensus is always the same. German is the best. US doesn't come close. Its all in the prep work, the road bed. Maybe the two layers of concrete matters too. But in any case, its not even close.

I also found the video stupid. Wow, he saw some 911s. What did he'd expect to see? Its like they were born yesterday. He'd probably see the same thing in 1970.
grim is offline  
post #19 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-21-2019, 07:09 PM
Senior Member
 
Yadkin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 384
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 136 Post(s)
Garage
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by grim View Post
Could be. Here are several DOT studies of EU roads from the 90s. https://international.fhwa.dot.gov/P...rotour92-6.pdf and https://international.fhwa.dot.gov/Pdfs/Eurotour.pdf. Consensus is always the same. German is the best. US doesn't come close. Its all in the prep work, the road bed. Maybe the two layers of concrete matters too. But in any case, its not even close.
Again I don't think it's the base courses, but the pavement itself. Three things from the first study that are very different from US standards.
1. A concrete base on the shoulders is formed first, then they use steel rails to control the mechanized pavers. We use string lines (or lasers) and constantly adjust the equipment.
2. They use a denser concrete mixture, 5500 psi vs our 3500psi. Anything over 4500 psi is essentially waterproof. So the base below stays dryer, and spalling is non-existent.
3. They use a shaded curing process, basically long tents over the fresh concrete, for 7 days. Here we use the equivalent of lawn sprinklers to spray water and keep it cool that way. And only for 2 days.

2018 Macan Sports Edition, daily driver.
Yadkin is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search



  Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Taking the Macan to the German Autobahn ABusLux Porsche Macan Videos 9 07-16-2016 08:20 PM
Transition from a Macan Turbo to a 911S JoshuaKM1 Porsche 911 Forum 36 01-23-2016 07:13 PM
The Autobahn?? MDJAK Porsche Macan Lounge 18 03-11-2015 09:26 PM
Unofficial hierarchy on the autobahn vasans Porsche Macan Lounge 1 01-29-2015 02:31 PM
Macan S on German Autobahn Rooboy Porsche Macan Videos 22 05-12-2014 04:59 PM

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome