Paint hardness / quality - Porsche Macan Forum
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post #1 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-05-2016, 07:00 PM Thread Starter
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Default Paint hardness / quality

Before ordering my Macan GTS in Volcano Gray, I remember worrying about the color, due to being so dark, that any imperfections would show up, like it happens on black vehicles.

In addition to that, I had read on other forums about Porsche's paint being on the 'soft' side, with would make it more susceptible to swirls and hairline scratches.

I know that my two former BMW's F10 535 in Sphisto Gray and Carbon Black were nearly impossible to wash (two-bucket method, using foam gun, microfiber stuff and all) without ending up with some swirls in the paint, which drove me crazy.

Now I've had my GTS for nearly a month, and I'm quite pleasantly surprised to find the paint much more resistant than BMW's.

After several washes, there is not ONE single swirl, scratch, watermark, etc. I've gone obsessively over the whole vehicle and incredibly enough, the paint looks like it had just come out of the paint booth at Leipzig.

The reflection of the overhead fluorescent lights and the garage door opener on the paint is just unreal.

I don't know if to attribute this to having applied the Wolfgang Deep Gloss sealer and a coat of Wolfgang's Fuzion Carnauba wax from the very first day, or to Porsche's harder paint, but I am indeed extremely happy with the results so far.

Here are some pics to show exactly what I mean:





And just to be safe and keep it that way, I just installed a whole-house water softener system to reduce water spots to a minimum and a 150 MPH blower to dry it after washing, and reduce even further the possibility of any swirls while drying it.
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2017 Macan GTS. Volcano Gray, Black Leather Interior, Black RS Spyder Wheels /Summer Tires, Sports Aluminum PDK, Sport Mirrors, Adaptive Cruise / PAS, Ventilated Seats, Sport Chrono, PTV+, Surround View, Air Suspension / PASM, Black Roof Rails, PCM with Navigation, Lane Keep Assist, Lane Change Assist, LED Headlights, Smoking Package, 18-Way Seats, Premium Package Plus, Rear Sunblinds, Red GTS Logos, Chrome interior accents, Wireless Charger for iPhone, Armrest Tray, Smoked Side Reflectors.
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post #2 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-05-2016, 08:51 PM
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I too read about the softer paint thing, no personal experience, first pcar, so I also applied a ceramic paint coating then a sealant to my Macan day 1 and 2 respectively. I've been pleased with the endurance of the sealant alone when used on my Audi but they have very hard paint (also harder to correct).

Lets see how they hold up. @alex_c you take great care washing, the paint condition would not be as you describe if you got it washed elsewhere with any car I would say.
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post #3 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-06-2016, 12:08 AM
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I have noticed the flat black is unbelievably soft . Amazingly the metallic paints (even black) are not prone to the same ease of abrasion. Flat white is not bad though .It still wont deter me from a black car though .
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post #4 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-06-2016, 12:12 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by yrralis1 View Post
I have noticed the flat black is unbelievably soft . Amazingly the metallic paints (even black) are not prone to the same ease of abrasion. Flat white is not bad though .It still wont deter me from a black car though .


Larry, could it be that they use different formulae for the clear coat for metallics than non-metallic paints? In that case I would be a little worried about the Carmine Red too.

Is your black GTS metallic or regular?

2017 Macan GTS. Volcano Gray, Black Leather Interior, Black RS Spyder Wheels /Summer Tires, Sports Aluminum PDK, Sport Mirrors, Adaptive Cruise / PAS, Ventilated Seats, Sport Chrono, PTV+, Surround View, Air Suspension / PASM, Black Roof Rails, PCM with Navigation, Lane Keep Assist, Lane Change Assist, LED Headlights, Smoking Package, 18-Way Seats, Premium Package Plus, Rear Sunblinds, Red GTS Logos, Chrome interior accents, Wireless Charger for iPhone, Armrest Tray, Smoked Side Reflectors.
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post #5 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-06-2016, 12:35 AM
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I have dark blue metallic and the paint is INCREDIBLY soft....it gets scratched soooo easy !!
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post #6 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-06-2016, 12:46 AM
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Originally Posted by alex_c View Post
Larry, could it be that they use different formulae for the clear coat for metallics than non-metallic paints? In that case I would be a little worried about the Carmine Red too.

Is your black GTS metallic or regular?
It's metallic. I don't know the science behind the paint formula differences but all I have to do is breathe on my flat black 911 and it swirls back at me.
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post #7 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-06-2016, 01:07 AM
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In that case I would be a little worried about the Carmine Red too.

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post #8 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-06-2016, 06:18 AM
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Night blue metallic is as soft as a Pirelli Purple F1 tyre! I managed to scratch the paint only by leaning my jeans on car's back while taking stuffs from the trunk.


Glossy black interior trim gets scratched very easily too.


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post #9 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-06-2016, 08:51 AM
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Currently in the garage:
2017 Macan GTS , Carmine Red, Sports Chrono, Leather and Alcantara, Pano roof, 20" Black Spyder rims, LCA, tow bar, Porsche Entry, BOSE, black roof rails, Power Steering Plus, Heated front seats, Comfort lighting, Delivered 19 May 2016

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post #10 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-06-2016, 09:52 AM
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Originally Posted by alex_c View Post
I had read on other forums about Porsche's paint being on the 'soft' side
Good job

I think, perhaps, if they are Porsche forums, the people saying that might not understand what is really going on. Autopia.org or autogeekonline where the professional detailers live might have better information. In fact its the hard clear coat paints that scratch and that is where you see the perception of "scratch". They are simply easier to see on dark colors and easier on the flat colors than metallics. For some reasons, the metallics tend to hide the clear coat scratches better than the flat colors. And, of course, the whites and light silvers hide the scratches but they are there.

Here is a good reference What is the meaning of soft paint?

About 5 years ago when we first started reading and sometimes posting to Corvetteforum we would read statements by the members there about how soft Corvette paint is and this is the reason the paint on Corvettes scratch and swirl easy, read the same kinds of comments on Autopia.

"Then we started educating people that the paint on NEW Corvettes isn't soft, in most all cases we've experienced it's very hard and the problem is the people posting that Corvette Clear Coats are soft didn't understand the paint technology and confused paint softness with scratch-sensitive.
Read more at http://www.meguiarsonline.com/forumsshowthread.php?21067-What-is-the-meaning-of-soft-paintDDpBH3u5EzMpVEY.99"


"Here's another true statement... Anytime you're on a forum somewhere else besides MeguiarsOnline.com and you read some forum member making a post like this,

Subaru's have soft paint

or

Fords have hard paint

Disregard what this person has said, (remember their forum name and in the future question anything they post), and remember this instead...

You don't know if the paint on your car is hard or soft, or in better words, you don't know if the paint on your car is workable until you go out into your garage and work on your car. And by the word work, we mean the cleaning process, or the defect removal process.

Read more at http://www.meguiarsonline.com/forumsshowthread.php?21067-What-is-the-meaning-of-soft-paintDDpBH3u5EzMpVEY.99"


I believe this is true and they go on and explain how to do test patches as in here Paint Workability - The Hardness or Softness of your car's paint

I've worked guards red paint with about every level of grit with Menzernas and different pads. Porsche paint is not soft. That's not true of others. I have had other cars where using a PC, the paint color, meaning I had gone through the clear coat, was visible on a white pad. That means a thin clear coat and the clear coats can be thin.

I think the proper term is scratch susceptibility along with visibility. Dark colors make is easier to see than lights. Metallics hide the scratches in the clear coat.
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